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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Cap'n Kobold" data-source="post: 8196465" data-attributes="member: 6802951">It also appears that there are also some people who refuse to see someone with an ability score of 15 and a full standard array as extraordinary, no matter how amazing that is compared to the vast majority of the race's population.I think that we're mostly using Strength partly because there is more of physical indicator, whereas a race's better reflexes aren't as outwardly visible. Mostly however, it is because it can be translated into an actual measurement, which other abilities can't. (Even Intelligence corresponding to IQ doesn't really work.)People who want to keep ASIs as an option are saying that a halfling being able to lift 450lbs (10x body weight)  is fine.You said that they can't imagine a strong halfling.Therefore either a: You don't consider someone able to lift 450lbs as "strong". (Whether they are the size of a 6-year-old child or not.)b: You don't actually understand what those people are really asking for.or c: You're lying.So, maybe there should be a sidebar, or piece of advice for DMs that says they don't have to use it if they don't like it?Non-optimisers aren't going to pigeonhole halflings as weak: If they want to play a strong halfling character then they will.Its only the optimisers who will pigeonhole a halfling as weak, because they must have that extra +1 to consider playing a character.And I'm pointing out that your argument is not actually in conflict with the people wanting racial ASIs to still be an option, because they are fine with short, strong people.Conflict only arises if you start claiming that someone with a 15 strength isn't strong. Because then you are arguing against something that they would like to be an option. As well as with me, who is objecting to the real-life elitism inherent in the statement.You don't feel that someone could be a good actor by simply putting a high ability score into Charisma? (If they were a D&D character.) Why not?Can you point to three?Just three people in the whole of this thread who have actually said that.</blockquote>

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