D&D 5E What if you had to take a feat at ASI levels?

Charlaquin

Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
We all know feats are not all created equal, which makes the idea that they’re balanced against an ASI pretty dubious. One alternative is to just not use feats, since they are optional. But what about going the opposite direction? You can only take a feat when you reach an ASI level.

Obviously this would slow down ability bonus advancement. It would still be possible to increase ability scores with “half-feats,” but that limits your selection of feats, which seems like a reasonable trade-off to me. And even then you only get +1 instead of +2.

Has anyone tried this? If so, how did it go? If not, what are your thoughts about it?
 

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CreamCloud0

One day, I hope to actually play DnD.
The core concept is really interesting to me and I’d love to see how a game with it would play out, hopefully you’d see players experimenting with more niche feats seeing as once they’re not competing with ASIs they’ll take more than just the typical GWM or the like.

Edit: the ‘every feat* is a half feat’ method is a compromise if players really hate not getting their ASIs
*excepting some of the really powerful feats.
 



squibbles

Adventurer
We all know feats are not all created equal, which makes the idea that they’re balanced against an ASI pretty dubious. One alternative is to just not use feats, since they are optional. But what about going the opposite direction? You can only take a feat when you reach an ASI level.

Obviously this would slow down ability bonus advancement. It would still be possible to increase ability scores with “half-feats,” but that limits your selection of feats, which seems like a reasonable trade-off to me. And even then you only get +1 instead of +2.

Has anyone tried this? If so, how did it go? If not, what are your thoughts about it?
I haven't tried this.

I think if you did, It'd be important to address feat balance. Where using ASIs only lets you avoid the imbalance of feats, using feats only doesn't, even if it makes imbalance no worse. The easiest way would be a for players to have a gentleman's agreement to take feats of comparable strength--so you avoid a situation where one player has sharpshooter and crossbow expert and another player has linguist and elemental adept. Alternately, you could tinker with the overly strong or weak feats... but I'm sure this insight is a surprise to absolutely no one here at ENWorld.

The other issue is that some PCs need ASIs a lot more than they benefit from feats. Monks would have a bad time with this houserule (maybe make an exception for them?). So would unusual multiclass combinations (if multiclassing were permitted).

Apart from those issues, it's not gonna break the game, and I can see it being a good change of pace. It would incentivize more odd numbered ability scores on character creation and it would disincentivize PCs getting 20 in any ability score, since doing so without the Tasha's custom option would take at least 12 levels. That'd all make PCs a bit less powerful. But they would presumably be more interesting with feats than with ASIs, and it'd give permission to players who want to take, say, chef or wood elf magic (which are fine) without feeling like they're doing something wrong.

On the other hand, since there aren't that many cool and appealing feats--especially if players decide it's gauche to take SS, GWM, PAM, etc.--you might find that all your PCs now pick up their basic numbers increases via resilient and/or skill expert (which I would consider only marginally more interesting than ASIs). A lot of the fun and flavorful feats don't go together that well flavor-wise. For example: shadow touched and telekinetic are cool and work reasonably well together, since they can both add to the same ability score, but they don't intuitively fit with each other. Does this spur creativity by, for example, pushing the player to think of a good reason why they do go together (awesome), merely lead to the fluff of the feats being ignored (totally fine), or discourage players from taking them together (unfortunate). How much creative mileage you get out of the houserule is gonna depend a lot on the players.
 

dave2008

Legend
We all know feats are not all created equal, which makes the idea that they’re balanced against an ASI pretty dubious. One alternative is to just not use feats, since they are optional. But what about going the opposite direction? You can only take a feat when you reach an ASI level.

Obviously this would slow down ability bonus advancement. It would still be possible to increase ability scores with “half-feats,” but that limits your selection of feats, which seems like a reasonable trade-off to me. And even then you only get +1 instead of +2.

Has anyone tried this? If so, how did it go? If not, what are your thoughts about it?
We have been doing this from basically the beginning. It has worked great for us. Feats are much more interesting than a simple ability bonus. Also, it keeps bonuses lower which I think works better with the default monster math for our group. However, we do allow almost all UA feats, so we have a larger variety of options (and more half feats).

PS. I see concern about balance between feats. That has not been a concern/issue for us. My group doesn't seem to care if a feat is more or less powerful, just if it is interesting and fits their character. They definitely don't care if one character has "better" feats than another.
 

dave2008

Legend
The core concept is really interesting to me and I’d love to see how a game with it would play out, hopefully you’d see players experimenting with more niche feats seeing as once they’re not competing with ASIs they’ll take more than just the typical GWM or the like.
That is pretty much exactly what we have found.
 

DND_Reborn

The High Aldwin
But what about going the opposite direction? You can only take a feat when you reach an ASI level.
Honestly, over 90% of the time, players only take feats IME. Often they are half-feats to gain a bit of ASI, but very rarely do I ever see a player just take the ASI +2.

FWIW, we also retooled all the PHB feats into half-feats as well, but aren't using them yet.

Here is the URL if anyone wants to check it out. It does incorporate some house-rules as well, so keep that in mind if you look it over.


EDIT: We also use the UA skill-feats as well.
 
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A game might be able to start off at "level zero", by only having race stats plus a "background feat".

Maybe have two or so encounters. Then add the class stats.

I just played with only race and background in a school project.
I gave them a few more hp, because I did not want to scare them too much.
A background feat would have been appreciated. I actually went through the feats to cover for the possibility of someone chosing human.
For the feel of advancement I actually started with lower stats and gave them 3 +2 increases and some proficiencies of the class that fit best for their playstyle.
 

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