Why Fantasy?

In a vain attempt to drag this thread back on its actual topic(s):

Who prefers a genre other than fantasy for TTRPGs? What games do you prefer? What would it take for that preferred genre, do you think, to better compete with fantasy in the TTRPG mindspace?
"Prefer" is perhaps too strong a term, but certainly on at least equal footing are modern-day Spycraftian or Tintin-like action, sci-fi or space opera, cyberpunk, superheroes, or post-apocalyptic rebuilding. (Also something like Mouse Guard, which while it has swords and bows it doesn't have magic, so maybe it doesn't count as fantasy?)

As to what might have it "compete" better, good question. Even in my main group, where we are varied in our campaigns, has (I am now realizing) that same default gravitational well that is fantasy/D&D gaming. Maybe, in the modern environment, it's as simple as having some well-placed streamed games in other genres to both introduce to newer gamers that there are other genres/games and that there are aspects to them that are equally fun and different to the traditional fantasy modes of play.
 

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In a vain attempt to drag this thread back on its actual topic(s):

Who prefers a genre other than fantasy for TTRPGs? What games do you prefer? What would it take for that preferred genre, do you think, to better compete with fantasy in the TTRPG mindspace?
My preference is Pulp Adventure, it was reading Tarzan, The Phantom, Doc Savage and watching Land of the Lost and Indiana Jones that sparked the love of Pulp and Spirit of the Century that got me in to playing FATE.
Unfortunately, unless we get another film franchise like Indiana Jones on the scene (neither Tomb Raider nor Uncharted hit the mark), I dont think Pulp Adventure will ever have the popularity of classic Fantasy, but it does have a good niche following as seen in offerings like Outgunned and contenders like Savage Worlds. Arguably Call of Cthulhu is in the Pulp space too and its popularity is high.

I also love the Swords and Planets genre - from John Carter of Barsoom and Flash Gordon to Masters of the Universe but I'd include those under Fantasy
 

Swords.

People like swords because they're cool. Swords and armor and bows provide just enough verisimilitude for people who care. Swords with spells provides enough wackiness for people who prefer the rule of cool. Gamers like tactical differences between swords and ranged weapons. Storytellers want swords so their hero has an excuse to get all up in the bad guy's face, or challenge him to a close quarters duel. Sword fights are great for suspense. Swords provide gore for horror. Swords are the best last weapon in your dystopia. Swords are a great murder weapon for your mysterious assassination. Swords are great for history buffs to fawn over. Swords are sexy.

And fantasy sits all nice and pretty in the middle of all of that, with a clearly communicated and easily understood premise. And it has swords. Lots of swords.

I came to this conclusion a few days ago during my sleep deprived mania and digging into my own sources of inspiration and going 'oh...yeah...yeah this!'

The Sword, is a pivotal aspect.
 

I came to this conclusion a few days ago during my sleep deprived mania and digging into my own sources of inspiration and going 'oh...yeah...yeah this!'

The Sword, is a pivotal aspect.
I don't think this is untrue, but many genres besides fantasy deploy the sword, from mechs to space opera to John Wick. We can't call everything that uses swords "fantasy."
 

I think the RPG offer is actually quite wide; I don’t think there much to be done to improve the place of other genres in the RPG mindscape other than somehow convincing more people to play these games. More visibility could help, as well a production value that can rival with D&D. But the products are there. If we ignore the demographics of who is playing what and the number of copies sold by game, I’m not certain fantasy RPGs are that much superior in number of games.
I think this is already in progress. Its just that there are two generations heading for their twilight bitter that they had to spend decades doing nothing but D&D. While D&D might still be the big dog by a country mile, folks are finding and supporting other genres more than ever.
 

My elk tags for archery and rifle each year will beg to differ.... :P

sure, archery is more training, but.... with same training my rifle has some words to say on this subject.
Sure, but that's a modern rifle, not something people were using in the 1500-1600s, I presume. I mean, I know some people are into black powder shooting, although I've never heard of people hunting with muzzle-loaders in this day and age.
 

I think this is already in progress. Its just that there are two generations heading for their twilight bitter that they had to spend decades doing nothing but D&D. While D&D might still be the big dog by a country mile, folks are finding and supporting other genres more than ever.
I think they always were, though. In 1983-1985 or so, I know for sure that I played some Star Frontiers, some Top Secret, dabbled a bit in Call of Cthulhu and even had a look at James Bond and a few others. But we always came back to and played a lot more D&D than anything else. I'm not sure that I can explain why; I had just as much fun with those other games (and more) but somehow D&D was always the common denominator of the hobby.

And even some of the non-D&D games, like WFRP or RuneQuest or EarthDawn or whatever else we flirted with were still definitely fantasy, in the same wheelhouse more or less as D&D.
 
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In High School I wrote a one act play for a competition which was a "generic medieval fantasy" story. It was a "hit" and I had a lot of fun staging it, so for the next year I wanted to write another one. But obviously it was time to stretch my wings and conquer new genres as a playwright, and kicking around ideas I quickly realized that I couldn't think of any other genre where I was as comfortable just writing with no research whatsoever. My second play ended up being fantasy but (ostensibly) set in 19th century Europe, and even that specificity required a little research and (more importantly) anxiety about whether I knew enough about the setting.

For whatever reason I think "generic vaguely medieval European fantasy" is a genre where everyone feels like they know the default setting rules (which have almost no relationship to anything actually medieval, but that's a different conversation for a different day) and have fairly similar expectations. This is tremendously helpful when playing an imagination game where players are called upon to do whatever they want and information about the world around them at any given moment may be absent or poorly communicated.

In a setting where players know what to expect they are comfortable driving action. When they show up at a village they know they can go to the tavern for lodgings, and can seek out a general store or a blacksmith (both of which will be happy to not only sell them things but buy their used junk). When some bandits show up they assume they can just kill these outlaws, not need to only fight defensively while they flee to go find some sort of police. You can of course play against these tropes and assumptions, but many of the worst campaigns I experienced or heard about were full of smug npcs telling PCs everything they assumed they knew was wrong.

Now are there other types of settings that work equally well? One would think the real world (either modern day or "familiar" historical eras) would work just as well in terms of assumed understanding of setting rules, but that opens you up to research rabbit holes over stupid details. I've never been in a Call of Cthulu game that did not at some point get derailed for several minutes while we litigated whether X tech was widely available in the 1920s or whatever, and while this occasional hiccup in actual gameplay may not be a huge issue, I think (to many of us at least) it is much more intimidating to design stories set in settings where there might be obscure anachronisms hiding in the weeds or whatever.

Of course, counter to the point I was making about generic medieval fantasy's strength being that people had strong ideas of default setting assumptions, fantasy, more broadly, is the genre of grandiose worldbuilding; of the author being god of their own little universe. And this also, of course, has a strong correlation of why a certain subset of people get into being GMs in TTRPGs. Even though in actuality fiction set in a non-magical real world or real world adjacent setting can involve a tremendous amount of worldbuilding as one develops characters, organizations, and their relationships and history, and even the hardest Science Fiction has potentially yet more worldbuilding, nevertheless fantasy is the genre where the iconic creators are basically all massive worldbuilders and thus people with the worldbuilding impulse natually flock to it.
 
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I don't think this is untrue, but many genres besides fantasy deploy the sword, from mechs to space opera to John Wick. We can't call everything that uses swords "fantasy."

Yeah, not in the classic sense of Fantasy (the Genre) but as a reason why Fantasy is popular, it certainly must apply as it requires zero justification. "Yeah, its a gritty fantasy world, of course they have swords."
 

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