The Manual of Monster Creation: Better Design Guidelines

[Tequila Sunrise]

This thread is to discuss my Manual of Monster Creation that quite a few folks have shown interest in recently. So if you're into monster creation, give it a read and tell me what you think!

TS

 

[Ry]

Solid, solid work here. I'm Ryan Stoughton, and I approve this pdf.

 

[firesnakearies]

This is really cool, and I like it! Kudos to you for making this.

One thing perplexed me, though. It seems to me that following your suggestions makes high-end monsters kind of ridiculously easy to hit. The Tarrasque with an AC of 37? (That would be Orcus with an AC of 42.)

It's very easy to make a 30th level human fighter with just the Player's Handbook who, totally unbuffed and "all the time" has a +36 to hit. So, I have to roll a 2 or higher to hit the Tarrasque? Or a 6 to hit Orcus or an Ancient Red Dragon? With the plethora of easily available temporary or situation bonuses, I'd probably be hitting Orcus on a 2 or higher most of the time, as well. That seems way too easy to me.

What are your thoughts on this?

 

[Tequila Sunrise]

Solid, solid work here. I'm Ryan Stoughton, and I approve this pdf.

Thanks for the kind words!

One thing perplexed me, though. It seems to me that following your suggestions makes high-end monsters kind of ridiculously easy to hit. The Tarrasque with an AC of 37? (That would be Orcus with an AC of 42.)

It's very easy to make a 30th level human fighter with just the Player's Handbook who, totally unbuffed and "all the time" has a +36 to hit. So, I have to roll a 2 or higher to hit the Tarrasque? Or a 6 to hit Orcus or an Ancient Red Dragon? With the plethora of easily available temporary or situation bonuses, I'd probably be hitting Orcus on a 2 or higher most of the time, as well. That seems way too easy to me.

My assumption when writing this pdf was that the PCs would be created with "casual optimization." By that I mean that their players would generally follow the character build guidelines in the PHB and use basic strategy during combat, but wouldn't comb the PHB looking for every last +1 bonus or demonstrate tactical genius. Hence, I assumed that a PC would get the following bonuses per tier:
+5 level
+2 item
+1.5 ability
+8.5 total

In the case of a 30th level fighter, my assumptions would be:
+15 level
+6 item
+8 ability
+1 weapon talent
+30 total (So Big T would get hit on a 7...that is low, but then again he is a brute.)

So yes, PCs do become slightly better at hitting monsters as they gain levels...by 1 point over 30 levels. What it comes down to is that I'd rather that the PCs get better by 1 point, rather than getting worse by 6 points. As always, the DM can nudge monster stats up or down to suit his PCs; I just figure that my way less nudging is needed and there's no increasing risk of TPKs. I also think that it's better to slant monster stats toward the casual gamer rather than the gamer who can squeeze a dozen little bonuses out of their PC; between a DM of casual players and a DM of heavy optimizers, I think that the latter is likely better able to nudge monster stats and therefore the heavier burden of nudging should be on him.

I hope that sheds some light on my thought process behind this pdf. I may at some point fine-tune the base monster stats to make them a little tougher over the course of all 30 levels.

TS

 

[JVisgaitis]

Do these numbers take into account a monsters Strength and Dexterity modifiers for attack rolls or is that supposed to be added in after you do the formula?

 

[Tequila Sunrise]

Do these numbers take into account a monsters Strength and Dexterity modifiers for attack rolls or is that supposed to be added in after you do the formula?

I only take ability modifiers into account for skills. For combat stats, they're completely irrelevant. That may seem strange, but if you take a close look at MM stats you'll find that the monster designers themselves didn't take ability modifiers into account.

TS

 

[JVisgaitis]

I only take ability modifiers into account for skills. For combat stats, they're completely irrelevant. That may seem strange, but if you take a close look at MM stats you'll find that the monster designers themselves didn't take ability modifiers into account.

I actually created a primitive spreadsheet in Excel that auto calculates everything and when I was comparing to creatures in the MM, I thought you weren't counting them. Thanks!

 

[Guyanthalas]

Let me double check this. According to the PDF, elites and solos are the exact same thing? Their stats are substantially different in the DMG. Now, granted I've been up coding in excel now for a few hours.. so my brain is a little fried. But I did want to understand how to value the HP/Defense of elites vs. solos before completeing (and publishing) my excel file. Don't they serve different functions in gameplay?

 

[Guyanthalas]

I created an excel file that automates the creation process (mostly). Its in beta. Feel free to try it out!