Use Magic Device vs. Runestaff

[neth123]

Can a rogue use a Use Magic Device check to satisfy the requirements for using a Runestaff from the Magic Item Compendium? Including the requirement that the spell being cast also appears on the casters spell list?

Also, if the answer is no, does having a single level in wizard change the answer.

My PC's finally came into some GPs recently, and their rogue is planning on buying a runestaff or two so he can switch out between teleporting, and another one that gives access to a few of the choiciest evocation spells.

 

[Runestar]

Runestaff requires that you actually expend a spell slot to cast the appropriate spell.

Even if your rogue successfully UMDs a runestaff into adding its spells to your spell list, you still can't cast them since he won't have any spell slots to use, and simulating a spell slot isn't a valid use of the UMD skill.

So if you want to cast a 4th lv spell from a runestaff, you must actually have 4th lv spell slots available. So you would need 7 lvs of wizard for that.

Your rogue is better off with scrolls or wands.

 

[Nebten]

I had a tough time trying to figure this one out, but I think it may fall under "Emulate a Class Feature." Of course, one would be emulating a class feature of a 7th level wizard which would be a DC 27 and would have to have the minium Int which would be a 14 (which at higher levels could be an afterthought).

In either case, a single level of wizard changes nothing. But in the end, agreeing with Runestar, stick to scrolls.

 

[neth123]

That was my first reaction as well, but then he pointed out in the PHB, under the heading "Emulate a class feature" there is an example of Lidda finding a chalice that turns water into holy water when a cleric channels positive energy into the chalice. This example leads me to believe that a turn attempt is expended to do so, and yet Lidda is able to use this function of the UMD skill simply by emulating the ability to turn undead.

 

[Runestar]

Unless the entry explicitly states that the magic chalice actually requires you to expend a turn attempt to achieve the desired effect, I would say that is simply creative license. UMD would let you simulate having turn undead for purposes of interacting with other abilities, but would not give you any actual turn undead attempts to use.

 

[neth123]

Any Idea if the chalice mentioned in the example is a real magic item from one of the sourcebooks?

 

[Elethiomel]

Using Use Magic Device to get access to spells outside your specialisation school may still be useful for high level Wizard/Loremaster characters, as the Loremaster prestige class gets access to UMD. Thanks for the tip.

 

[Physiker]

We had this discussion too, but in our case it was a beguiler who uses this tactic to get more spells. And we decided that he could "emulate" the spell list of a wizard but has to pay an appropriate spell slot.

It's also possible to get around prohibited schools for a spec wiz / rog or bard.

 

[Jhaelen]

Hmm, we had a similar situation regarding the use of psionic power stones and use psionic device. More specifically, the question was if a rogue would be able to somehow 'emulate' spending power points to augment the stone's power.

I allowed it though I thought it was somewhat fishy.

I wonder if it would change anything if the rogue also had access to a cognizance crystal containing stored power points? Could those be used to fulfill the requirement?

 

[FEADIN]

The ability to cast a spell is a class feature, casting a spell is not, same is true for psionic powers.