Shadowdancer variant (rogue/wizard)

[Jimlock]

Hello everyone!
This is my first post/thread in this forum.. (Hope i'm in the right category..)

I 've recently came up with a new Shadowdancer variant destined for multiclassed rogues/wizards (or sorcerers), and i would like to know what you think of it as far as game-balance is concerned (whether its overpowered, weak or simply normal..)

Story-wise, i' ve written plenty of stuff regarding their history, background, reasons for having the mix of powers they have etc... I will not tire you with it though. I'll stick to the game mechanics and hope to hear from you guys soon!

Here it is:



Hit die: d4

Requirements:

Skills: Move Silently 8 ranks, Hide 10 ranks, Perform (dance) 5 ranks, Knowledge (arcana) 5 ranks.
Spells: Ability to cast at least one arcane spell of 2nd level or higher (3rd level Wizard).
Special: Sneak attack +3d6 (5th level Rogue).


BAB: medium (+7 at 10th level)
Saves: For=Bad, Ref=Good, Wis=Good.

Skill Points at Each Level: 4 + Int modifier

Class skills:
Balance, Bluff, Concentration, Climb, Decipher Script, Diplomacy, Disable Device, Disguise, Escape Artist, Forgery, Gather Information, Hide, Jump, Knowledge (arcana), Knowledge (local), Listen, Move Silently, Open Lock, Perform, Search, Sense Motive, Sleight of Hand, Spellcraft, Spot, Swim, Tumble,Use Magic Device, and Use Rope.

Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Gain no proficiency with any weapon or armor.

1st: HIPS, +1 level of existing class (Spells per day)
2nd: Darkvision, S.A. +1d6
3rd: Shadow illusion, summon shadow, +1 level of existing class
4th: Shadow jump 20ft.
5th: Def. Roll, Unc. Dodge, S.A. +2d6
6th: Shadow jump 40ft. , summon shadow, +1 level of existing class
7th: Slippery Mind, S.A. +3d6
8th: Shadow jump 80ft. , +1 level of existing class
9th: Summon shadow
10th: Shadow jump 160ft. , improved evasion, S.A. +4d6

Thanks in advance.

 

[Dandu]

Seems ok.

 

[Jimlock]

Thanks Dandu!

Here is the sum up of the changes in regard to the original Shadowdancer in the DMG.

Requirements: Removed all Feats. Added the +3d6 S.A and the 2nd level spell (5th Rogue / 3rd Wizard). Added Knowledge (arcana): 5 Ranks.

Hit Die: 4 instead of 8

Will Save: Good instead of Bad

Skill Points at Each Level: 4+Int instead of 6+Int

Class Skills: Same + Wizard's Class Skills

Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Removed All (Rogue's are enough)

Special Abilities: Same as the DMG Shadowdancer except for the following:

Removed Evasion and Uncanny Dodge at 2nd Lvl.
Sneak Attack:
Added +1d6 S.A. at 2nd,5th,7th and 10th Lvl (once every 2Lvls/3Lvls)
Spells per Day:
+1 level of existing class at 1st,3rd,6th,8th Lvl (once every 2Lvls/3Lvls)


..I Guess the concept was to blend into the Shadowdancer some of the Arcane Trickster (which is a much more powerful PrC IMO)

Arcane Trickster: (3rd Rogue / 5th Wizard)
100% Spell Progression, 100% S.A. Progression, BAB: Bad + Arcane Trickster Special Abilites (Mediocre)

Shadowdancer: (5th Rogue / 3rd Wizard)
40% Spell Progression, 80% S.A. Progression, BAB: Medium + Shadowdancer Special Abilities (Good/Very Good)

..What do you Think???

 

[Jimlock]

i also found the following Shadowdancer Variants

http://dungeons.wikia.com/wiki/Shadowdancer,_Tome_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)

Very unbalanced IMO

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Shadow_Dancer_Variant_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)

Better. Still Shadow Jump gets very strong (swift action)

Eagerly awaiting for your opinions!!!!

 

[Jimlock]

Can't be so bad that no one wants to say a word....?????

 

[Dandu]

i also found the following Shadowdancer Variants

http://dungeons.wikia.com/wiki/Shadowdancer,_Tome_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)

Very unbalanced IMO

It's so broken, the link takes you to a non-existent page!

However, if it's a Tome class (from Frank and K's Tome series) it's supposed to be on par with high power builds (straight Wizards who specialized in Transmutation, Druids, etc) so it's going to be a lot more capable than the default Shadowdancer class.

 

[Jimlock]

It's so broken, the link takes you to a non-existent page!

Funny the link is broken! Just Google "Shadowdancer Variant" and it shows up in 5th place, and opens correctly!! (Guess you know that allready since you checked the PrC!)

Didn't know about Tome and stuff... thanks for the info..(still looks pretty broken though!)

So... Dandu since you are the only one kind enough to post a reply in this thread... Do you have any other remarks regarding my Variant?

Mine is not destined for high power builds... its just a prestige class i hope is balanced enough in respect to other PrCs in the core books..

A friend said he's a bit weak, considering his hit die and Spell progression.. but i believe that any more spells per day would make him stronger than normal...

???

 

[Dandu]

Well, it's not overpowered, but it's probably a little weak compared to what you'd be able to do as a straight wizard, or if you went into Arcane Trickster. Those 5 caster levels mean a lot. It's better for a Rogue with magic as a hobby than a Wizard who dabbles in thievery.

 

[Jimlock]

Well, it's not overpowered, but it's probably a little weak compared to what you'd be able to do as a straight wizard, or if you went into Arcane Trickster. Those 5 caster levels mean a lot. It's better for a Rogue with magic as a hobby than a Wizard who dabbles in thievery.

Can't argue with that... Actually that is the point. I never ment it as a Wizard's alternate. Its more about powering up a very nice and colorfull PrC that everybody likes, but noone bothers to take... with the exception of a 1st Level dip just for HIPS... S.A. progression should have been there in the first place as well.
So yes... its ment for a rogue who can pull off a few magic tricks as well. (illusions, Disguise Self, Alter Self, Rope Trick, Spider Climb, Web... etc etc)
There are plenty of low level spells that come very handy to characters of the like.

 

[Dandu]

Pity it locks out purely martial builds like Rogue/Monk.