General RPG DiscussionDiscussion of all RPGs and non-system-specific topics. DM/GM/player issues, settings, etc. Rules discussion belongs in one the forums below.
I once teleported a group into the middle of Sunless Citadel, and it worked great.
Do you remember the thread on map design and how it relates to adventure? I realized while looking at his diagram of SC that I had completely changed the character of the dungeon.
Instead of an entrance, a few short branches, a loop and then a long string, I placed the PCs in the middle of the main loop. This made the original entrance a path to more exploratory adventure, and the immediate choice of which way to go on the loop more significant and less obvious. In short, the whole dungeon opened up.
So in summary, my advice to you is: analyze the map. Pick an adventure that has an interesting map, but make it one that becomes MORE interesting because you placed the PCs in the middle (and obviously, pick an interesting spot in the middle).
PS
__________________ You can clean up vomit, but data is always messy. - Storm's Law
I don't care if you light his face on fire and put it out with an anvil... - A. Taylor
So in summary, my advice to you is: analyze the map. Pick an adventure that has an interesting map, but make it one that becomes MORE interesting because you placed the PCs in the middle (and obviously, pick an interesting spot in the middle).
On that basis, drop them into the Greater Caverns map from S4 Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth: one of the best maps out there B1's level 1 map also rocks, along with G1's dungeon level, or any of the levels in G3 or WG5.
Since they're in a cave, you could also drop them into wilderness a la Gygax's Alice adventures EX1/EX2, or perhaps S4/WG4 mountains, or WG6/Isle of Dread bluffs caves, for example. Or even drop them into an "oasis cave" in X4/X5 and then let them fend for themselves
__________________ grodog
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Allan Grohe
Editor and Project Manager Black Blade Publishing
There's always the good ol' Hidden Shrine of Tamoachan. That one was written to be explored backwards.
That really is the perfect choice.
If you don't have access to the adventure (it's an oldie) the PCs are trapped in the deepest part of the dungeon and have to find their way out before the poison gas (the whole dungeon is filled with poison gas) gets them. The gas has some mild but cumulative effect (like -2 to con every hour or some such) so there's plenty of time ... as long as you don't need to rest.
The beauty of this adventure is that the PCs can't waste time screwing around. They need to be "efficient".
I strongly suggest giving this one a look-see if you can get your hands on it.
__________________ I am not a number! I am a human being!
I left my last game in a cliffhanger - 5th level PCs were teleported by fey to a dark, dank cave. That's all they know - they haven't actually seen anything, they just know it's cold and damp and dark and echoey.
So ... where would YOU put them?
I was thinking of sticking them on a level of the Tomb of Abysthor. But I'd love to hear your wild suggestions!
Somewhere in Ravenloft (well almost all games I am involved with end up there soon or later, so it is the first thing that comes to mind)
Relatedly, Sep, do you have any plans to publish Afqithan, by chance? I think it would be pretty modular compared to the rest of the Wyre corpus of materials, and would be pretty plug-and-play for most DMs.
__________________ grodog
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Allan Grohe
Editor and Project Manager Black Blade Publishing
__________________ Words of wisdom from Gary Gygax:
From my perspective wanting less in the way of rules constraints comes from being a veteran Game Master who feels confident that more good material comes from imagination and player interaction with the environment than from textbook rules material.
more words of wisdom:
Rashness and foolhardiness are harbingers of death, as is timidity, in such adventure setting.
Those that complain about real challenges might be better off playing Candyland with their little sister
First and foremost, munchkinism arose as a contemporary of the OD&D game. Nothing in the rules of that or any other version of the game was needed to make it flourish.
There is no relationship between 3E and original D&D, or OAD&D for that matter. Different games, style, and spirit.
[E]xperience has taught me that everyone has their own gaming preferences, and it is not a matter of "good" or "bad" in all, save in light of one's own preferences.
Something classic is what first spring to mind: A4, Tomb of Horrors, Ghost Tower of Inverness, Ravenloft, Greyhawk Castle, and Blackmoor Castle spring to mind.
Whoever said Entombed with the Pharoahs and S4, those are good ideas too --- basically, taking the campaign somewhere new and unexpected compared to most D&D settings. On that note, if you wanted to try something like Eberron, this would be a chance.
Let me be a second voice for the perhaps rather unlikely choice of a custom adventure.
I was thinking that this cave would actually be part of a very small island (more like an outcropping of rock) in the middle of the ocean. The players emerge, to find that there are some aquatic humanoid types conducting some kind of ritual, but attack when they detect the players. Now, the kicker is that the players reach this island at low tide, and it is slowly going to sink out from beneath them, so they have to use what is on hand to try and keep themselves floating. That is when the giant sea monster of doom comes. Seeing that the players have slain its servitors, who were offering the sacrifice that drew it here, it gets a little angry, and annoyed. It toys with the players a little, but then offers them a chance to live if they will pledge themselves to its service for a time. Where you go from there...
Anyway, just a thought.
__________________ -Kaodi
Good name in man and woman, dear my lord,
Is the immediate jewel of their souls.
Who steals my purse steals trash; 'tis something, nothing;
'Twas mine, 'tis his, and has been slave to thousands;
But he that filches from me my good name
Robs me of that which not enriches him
And makes me poor indeed.
-Iago, Shakespeare's Othello, Act III. Scene III. Lines 180-186.
I like Tamoachan. It's one of my favourite adventures, and the "must get out" feel to it is great. There are a lot of exploration side-tracks that will harm the party, draining their resources. It can be fun to tempt them with gold, but they know that if they take the bait, they're gonna get weaker, and they still have to escape the dungeon without resting.
The adventure was written for tournament play, and that guides the whole process. Some of the encounters are just lovely (you fight a giant slug that is an ancient "god", and many of the monsters have names reminiscent of Aztec mythology). There is an encounter with a talking crayfish riding a giant hermit crab - pure genius. Plus a hall where the PCs have to play that "Aztec Soccer/Basketball" game against animated ghosts, and, of course, fighting a giant bat-god.
When it was touched upon in the Savage Tide AP, I really expanded the Tamoachan elements, using the talking crayfish as a guide and NPC that really confused my PCs (but in a good way). Having a crayfish shout out "Bow down and pay your respects before me, lest you suffer my much-feared wrath!" is pure fun. The Players loved it.
__________________ Current Campaign:The Shattered Isles Homebrew - Hammer (Minotaur Fighter 8), Kirra (Drow Rogue 8), Shedin (Dragonborn Paladin 8), Zahar (Half-Eladrin/Half Drow Bard 8), and Seahorse (Halfling Rogue 8). Currently the group is in the Feywild, trying to discover who is poisoning the drow.
Part of my problem as a DM is I often have these vague ideas but have trouble getting them solidified.
I have two routes I could see: 1) they had just been in "faerie land" and so this could be bringing them back to their own world but just in a different place. 2) this could fling them even further afield in some way. I have this vision of them wandering these caves, seeing stranger and stranger monsters and situations (weird minerals, gasses, etc.) and when they emerge they look into the night sky and see ... their home planet. This also ties into a brief run-in with "moon men" they had in an earlier adventure. Hmm...
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