Free Will and Geas/Quest (and Lesser Geas/Quest)

Does the subject of the spell get to resist if, if they want -- in other words, not fulfill the order, and just take the nasty hit?

Or MUST they try to fulfill it . . . and then take the hit if they fail?

I ask because while I do not have the text in front of me, I recall that the text of Lesser Geas suggests the 2nd, and Geas suggests the first.

TIA!

This is one of those questions everyone has an opinion about, but nobody has an answer. I think you can find text in the spell to support either position. On one hand, if the subject has no choice but to follow it seems overpowered, but if the subject can just ignore the orders and look for a cleric/wizard to dispel the quest/geas, then it seems underpowered.

Hopefully someone has official word from the Sage or another source.

*BUMP*

I understand that it's a tough question, given the obvious contradiction in the wording between Lesser Geas and Geas . . . I am wondering how you all play them, though.

Seems pretty straightforward, though I have one question with Geas/Quest.

This just happened to us. One character was told to kill his companions. He obviously ignore the request. He will take 3d6 hp per day. Now, say he fails his save and becomes sickened. He now can't be magically healed and heals at 1/10 normal rate. Does that mean that the 3d6 will eventually kill him? What if he fails his next save and become crippled. The next day, the 3d6 will kill him, right? Problem is, when he's crippled, he can't perform the Quest, so he's totally screwed, right?

If that's all correct, that's one nasty spell!

My take on the spell is that the recipient can choose to follow the geas or not. If it cast in battle, he does not have to do it that instant...he can always wait till later in the day and that should still satisfy the spell.

Yes, the spell is nasty over a longer period of time if the recipient ignores the Geas. It's not an effective combat spell, but it is a good spell for out of combat scenarios.

Also, remember that if you are able to cast Geas at an opponent, there is a strong chance that opponent can get it removed later without too much hassle.

Does the subject of the spell get to resist if, if they want -- in other words, not fulfill the order, and just take the nasty hit?

Or MUST they try to fulfill it . . . and then take the hit if they fail?

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A character can always choose NOT to fulfill the command of a geas, but then takes the "hit". They get a will save to resist the onset of the spell with lesser geas. They don't with geas.

The character cannot attempt to "delay" the fulfillment of the order, unless they can interpret the order in some twisted fashion.

Seems pretty straightforward, though I have one question with Geas/Quest.

This just happened to us. One character was told to kill his companions. He obviously ignore the request. He will take 3d6 hp per day. Now, say he fails his save and becomes sickened. He now can't be magically healed and heals at 1/10 normal rate. Does that mean that the 3d6 will eventually kill him? What if he fails his next save and become crippled. The next day, the 3d6 will kill him, right? Problem is, when he's crippled, he can't perform the Quest, so he's totally screwed, right?

If that's all correct, that's one nasty spell!

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It's worse than that - you don't get the save to avoid being sickened. However, once crippled - the spell is at it's worst - it can no longer continue to deal the 3d6 damage. In this case - the character need not "make the choice each day" - only once. The character in question lays there until he either starves or the geas is lifted.

The spell is - bluntly - utterly and totally broken.

My take on the spell is that the recipient can choose to follow the geas or not. If it cast in battle, he does not have to do it that instant...he can always wait till later in the day and that should still satisfy the spell.

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In the heat of battle - against a wizard - I geas him...

"thou shalt not attempt to use magic in any shape way or form".

...

He takes 3d6 each time he tries to cast a spell, and the fighter takes 3d6 every ROUND he wears magic armor or for every ATTACK he tries to make with His sword.

Geas doesn't have it's uses in combat - eh?

Furthermore - you can always use 2 geas... one to ban the action - and one to force them to perform the action... they wind up setting off one of the geas... and start dying horribly.

The spell is utterly and totally BROKEN AND UNBALANCING as written; and anybody who tells you differen't hasn't run up against a player who knows how to word geas correctly.

Er, actually, they wouldn't take damage every time they use magic...read the spell, it says if you don't follow through with the quest, then you take 3d6 PER DAY...so unless you cast wish and make time speed up so that a round equals a day, I think that this is a no go ;-)

Not to say that I don't think the spell is screwy, I just had to clear up that obvious misreading

Be a bit rational, please.

Firstly, geas does 3d6 damage per day. Therefore, in a combat situation it is almost entirely useless for purposes of damage.

Secondly, if you are using it in combat, then your foes are likely to be of equivalent level to you. If they therefore survive the combat, it will be easy for them to cast Break Enchantment or the like.

Putting these two together, Geas is not a 'BROKEN AND UNBALANCING' spell. It adds some flavour to the campaign, explains why minions do not betray their evil masters and compels low-level PCs to perform their quests.

As a combat spell, it is of relatively minimal use. Compare it with e.g.s Harm, Disintegrate or Flesh to Stone, all of which are equivalent level...remember the Fort save to ignore the crippling; otherwise they are merely sickened and take a trivial amount of damage.

Not to mention the fort save to avoid the sickening, too ;-)

I still think it's a weird spell, though...too many interpretations, too few chances to resist, etc. etc.

Er, actually, they wouldn't take damage every time they use magic...read the spell, it says if you don't follow through with the quest, then you take 3d6 PER DAY...

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See where you are going - but with that particular phrasing of a geas - you can break it, then choose to conform to the geas, and then break it again within the context of a combat.

A geas is triggered upon each breach of the geas; not just the first breach.

If I am geased with "thou shalt not steal"; and I pick somebody's pocket on the street - I set off the geas; and take 3d6. If I then go into a gemshop an hour later and steal the stash of jewels - I set the geas off again; taking another 3d6.

If you can manage to continuously "disobey" the geas - you only get the 3d6 on a per day basis; this is true; but these wordings can bring down "multiple breaches" quite readily.