9th-level Druid build, 200 damage/round

kerbarian

Explorer
Okay, so the title is a little bit misleading -- the 200 damage is only vs AC15 or worse targets. However, the damage is still very good against higher-AC targets:

AC10 -> 203 damage/round (6 points of power attack)
AC15 -> 200 damage/round (6 points of power attack)
AC20 -> 150 damage/round (4 points of power attack)
AC25 -> 105 damage/round (2 points of power attack)
AC30 -> 62 damage/round (2 points of power attack)
AC35 -> 26 damage/round (0 points of power attack)

There are also some very nice benefits in addition to the raw damage, like AC35, fast healing 8, and a chance of dazing targets. Also, no pre-combat buffing is required.

The basics of the build are:

Druid 7 / Master of Many Forms 2, fighting in the form of a Cave Troll, using Leap Attack. So, an abuse of a couple perennial favorites: polymorph (wild shape in this case) and leap attack with charge + full attack.

The relevant feats used are power attack, leap attack, multiattack, and practiced spellcaster. A 9th-level character gets 36k worth of gear, and the build uses:

Large dragonscale full plate +2 (10k) -- sized for a cave troll
Boots of speed (12k)
Ring of protection +1 (2k)
Gauntlets of ogre strength (4k)
Armbands of might (4.1k)
Hat of disguise (1.8k) -- so as not to inspire panic in the masses by wandering around as a cave troll

Each use of wild shape lasts 9 hours, and you get 5/day, so that's plenty to stay in cave troll form at all times. However, you would have to put all your gear back on 3 times per day as it falls to the floor at the end of each wild shape. Also, with 2 4th-level spells per day (assuming Wis 18), that's enough to cover 18 hours/day with Enhance Wild Shape to gain the extraordinary special qualities of the cave troll form, meaning fast healing 8, darkvision 90', low-light vision, and scent.

The 3rd-level slots can be used to keep Greater Magic Fang in effect at all times, for +1 to all natural weapons.

2nd-level slots can be used for Barkskin, though not continuously, and Master Air for flight.

1st-level slots could be used for Surefooted Stride (since being able to charge is critical to this build) or just generally handy stuff like Entangle.

Using the boots of speed, the Druid can charge 120' and then make a full attack with 6 points of power attack against an AC15 target for:
3 claws (1 extra from haste) for 2d6 + 10 (str) + 1 (magic fang) + 2 (armbands) + 12 (power attack + leap) = 32
2 rakes for 2d6 + 5 + 1 + 2 + 12 = 27
1 bite for 1d8 + 5 + 1 + 2 + 12 = 24.5
1 rend (possibly) for 4d6 + 15 (str * 1.5) = 29

Question -- does the magic fang enhancement to damage apply to the rend? I'm not counting it...

The attack bonus is 6 (base) + 10 (str) + 2 (charge) +1 (haste) +1 (magic fang) -1 (size) -6 (power attack) = +13.

The claws and rakes hit on a 2, and the bite hits on a 4. Since each claw hits 95% of the time, there's a 99.3% of hitting with at least 2 out of 3 and triggering the rend and daze. Also, all of the attacks except for the rend add 5% to account for crits. That all adds up to:

(((.95 * 3 * 32) + (.95 * 2 * 27) + (.85 * 24.5)) * 1.05) + (.993 * 29) = 200 damage

Plus a 99.3% chance of requring the target to make a DC22 Fort save or be dazed for 1 round. The Druid also gets an improved grab if he hits with his bite, for even more damage plus an extra rake, but that can tie him up in a grapple and depends on the target's grapple check, so I didn't include it in the calculations.

The Druid's AC would be 10 + 11 (natural) + 4 (barkskin) + 10 (full plate +2) + 1 (dex) + 1 (haste) + 1 (ring of prot.) - 1 (size) - 2 (charge) = 35.

Finally, I know there's been some debate over Leap Attack when charging and making a full attack. If leap attack is taken out of the equation entirely, the damage is still very good:

AC10 -> 167 damage/round (6 points of power attack)
AC15 -> 165 damage/round (6 points of power attack)
AC20 -> 133 damage/round (3 points of power attack)
AC25 -> 97 damage/round (2 points of power attack)
AC30 -> 61 damage/round (0 points of power attack)
AC35 -> 26 damage/round (0 points of power attack)

So... is there anything I've done wrong in these calculations? What weaknesses would this character have? Are there any specific parts of this build that you'd disallow as a DM?
 

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monboesen

Explorer
So... is there anything I've done wrong in these calculations? What weaknesses would this character have? Are there any specific parts of this build that you'd disallow as a DM?

Other than Leap attack (if thats the power that lets you charge and full attack), Dragonscale armor (who the hell are butchering all these dragons and carving them into armor anyway), Polymorph/Master of many forms (just broken) nope, other than that there is nothing in that build I would disallow.
 

Plane Sailing

Astral Admin - Mwahahaha!
I'd argue that it isn't a druid build, it is a master of many forms build... and I don't allow master of many forms, I wouldn't allow "Enhance wild shape" (where is that from?).

At one point the druid wildshape could be buffed by animal growth (I guess it has been erratted now), but a druid wildshaped into a tiger with animal growth running and a pounce attack could do some nasty damage too, especially with the power attack. I daresay there are some additional spells put out somewhere that would raise damage to ludicrous levels too :)

Anyway, that's my opinion. If you can find the old Sultans of Smack thread you might want to add this in there (I can't remember what is considered qualifying for SoS)

Cheers
 

Iku Rex

Explorer
It's a good, solid build. Some comments:

- The character isn't proficient with heavy armor. Use darkleaf (A&EG or ECS) armor instead, to make it medium armor.

- I'm one of those who'd "debate" allowing the use of Leap Attack on all the attacks at the end of the charge. However, if you can trick a DM into allowing all those attacks as "charge attacks" you can do som truly sick damage. List of "charge-boosters": http://www.enworld.org/showpost.php?p=2903115&postcount=36 . (Most aren't applicable to pounce/natural weapons, but some are.)

- I don't think you'd have to put your gear on several times a day. You can use the wild shape ability in cave troll form.

- Technically, haste doesn't work with natural weapons. "[A] hasted creature may make one extra attack with any weapon he is holding". (I'd allow it though, and so would most DMs I think.) However, why not use a weapon? As written, Leap Attack triples the extra damage from power attack (12x3), making the first attack very impressive. (The first two attacks with your interpretation of Leap Attack.) It's probably better even if you "just" use 12x2 from Leap Attack.

- Other spells worth noting: Girallon's blessing (SC, 3rd) - even if the DM doesn't allow two rend attacks (I wouldn't) and lowers your regular cave troll claw damage, it will help your overall damage. Charge of the triceratops (SC, 3rd) adds yet another natural attack, if you have a 3rd level spell to spare and the time to cast it. Lion's Charge (SC, 3rd) lets you pounce in any form (handy if you want to change your perferred form to war troll later.)
 
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Infiniti2000

First Post
kerbarian said:
The relevant feats used are power attack, leap attack, multiattack, and practiced spellcaster.
You cannot take multiattack as a feat because a druid doesn't qualify for it. I don't recall the prerequisites for leap attack, so I'm not sure about that. This is highly debatable but I'd say it's split 50/50.

kerbarian said:
Large dragonscale full plate +2 (10k) -- sized for a cave troll
I'm not sure about the cost of this. Not only is it large, but it's not a humanoid, so I think the cost is even more. For example, just full plate +2 for a large nonhumanoid is 10150gp (1500*4 + 150 MW + 4000 magic). I'd have to think that the dragonscale part is even more, and x4 at that.

kerbarian said:
Are there any specific parts of this build that you'd disallow as a DM?
Besides the rules problem I noted above, I also do not allow MoMF.
 

Iku Rex

Explorer
Infiniti2000 said:
You cannot take multiattack as a feat because a druid doesn't qualify for it.
He does in cave troll form.

(For a published example, Masters of the Wild reprinted several "monster feats", like Multiattack, clarifying that access to a monster form through shapechanging was sufficient to take the feats.)

Infiniti2000 said:
I'm not sure about the cost of this. Not only is it large, but it's not a humanoid, so I think the cost is even more.
The table refers to body shape, not creature type. (It would be silly otherwise.) Cave trolls have a humanoid shape.

Infiniti2000 said:
I'd have to think that the dragonscale part is even more, and x4 at that.
"Dragonhide armor costs double what masterwork armor of that type ordinarily costs".

Masterwork full plate for Large humanoid creature: (1500*2)+150= 3150
Dragonhide: 3150*2= 6300 gp
+ 2 armor = +4000
Total: 10300 gp

(But again, darkleaf armor is the way to go.)
 

Infiniti2000

First Post
Iku Rex said:
He does in cave troll form.
You well know my answer to that. :)

Iku Rex said:
The table refers to body shape, not creature type. (It would be silly otherwise.) Cave trolls have a humanoid shape.
That is an unsubstantiated opinion. The table specifically refers to nonhumanoids. A cave troll is unquestionably a nonhumanoid. A humanoid is a defined game term, so nonhumanoid is anything of a different type.

Iku Rex said:
"Dragonhide armor costs double what masterwork armor of that type ordinarily costs".

So, that's confusing. Double the MW cost seems to imply also doubling the 150. Bizarre. So, it would be 1500*4*2 (quadruple normal cost, double that for dragonhide) + 150 (normal MW) + 150 (double MW as well for dragonhide) + 4000 (magic) = 12000+300+4000=16300 total.
 

Iku Rex

Explorer
Infiniti2000 said:
You well know my answer to that. :)
Actually, I don't. I think you have me confused with someone else. :confused:

Infiniti2000 said:
That is an unsubstantiated opinion.
Perhaps you overlooked the part where I pointed out that "it would be silly otherwise"? It should be self evident to just about everyone that an armor fits or not based on body shape, not creature type.
Infiniti2000 said:
The table specifically refers to nonhumanoids. A cave troll is unquestionably a nonhumanoid. A humanoid is a defined game term, so nonhumanoid is anything of a different type.
"Humanoid type" is indeed a defined game term. Humanoid is also a word in the English language. "Monstrous humanoids" don't have the humanoid type. "Humanoid" is used several places in the rules to refer to body shape, rather than creature type.

"A giant is a humanoid-shaped creature..."-- Giant type.
"If generally humanoid in form,..." --Abberation type
" It's possible for a creature with a humanoid-shaped body to wear as many as twelve magic items ..." -- Magic items on the body
 

Infiniti2000

First Post
Iku Rex said:
Actually, I don't. I think you have me confused with someone else.
Perhaps, but I'm not getting into that discussion so soon after the previous one. Let's merely call it arguable and IMO about half the people wouldn't allow it. To be generous to your view if you wish, call it a quarter of the people.

Iku Rex said:
Perhaps you overlooked the part where I pointed out that "it would be silly otherwise"? It should be self evident to just about everyone that an armor fits or not based on body shape, not creature type.
Ah, yes. The good ole strategy of using a "self-evident" argument. I can't beat that. What the heck was I thinking, arguing against self-evidence?!
 

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