Ready action gamebreaking situations

Madeiner said:

How would you deal with this situation?

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If my opponent expects me to zig, that's when I zag.

Remember, if B does anything other than attack A (and with a 5-foot reach melee weapon at that), then A's turn is completely wasted. So that's what B should do.

And as others have pointed out, all B really has to do is ready his own action to interrupt A's attack, and we have a Mexican standoff. Who's going to blink first?

But as DM, I would simply allow B to finish his move action before making his attack. D&D combat rounds are intended to be abstract, with actions occuring simultaneously even though they are resolved sequentially.

A wins intiative, readies attack against B when B attempts attack.
B moves next to A to attack.
A's readied action interrupts B's turn.
A attacks then takes 5' step.
B's turn RESUMES.

If B has movement remaining he simply moves the further 5' and then attacks. If B's normal movement cannot get him the further 5' to be adjacent to A then B can change his mind and do ANYTHING else he could normally attempt to do including the decision to charge instead of limit himself to normal movement. You do not have to DECLARE actions at the start of your turn and even if you do you are not obligated to do only what you declared. Even if you disagree and insist that isn't true, B would only lose his attack upon A for that turn. Next turn B's normal movement ensures that A's little trick no longer works since A is limited to only a 5' step. In fact, attempting it again on the second turn could ONLY place A 5' away from B, at which point B takes his own 5' step and then gets a Full Attack Action against A.

I don't see how it can be a perpetual advantage unless B's maximum movement is only 5' in the first place.

Man in the Funny Hat said:

A wins intiative, readies attack against B when B attempts attack.
B moves next to A to attack.
A's readied action interrupts B's turn.
A attacks then takes 5' step.
B's turn RESUMES.

If B has movement remaining he simply moves the further 5' and then attacks. If B's normal movement cannot get him the further 5' to be adjacent to A then B can change his mind and do ANYTHING else he could normally attempt to do including the decision to charge instead of limit himself to normal movement.

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He cannot decide to charge, because A interrupted B based up the fact that B ATTACKED. And if B attacked, then he can only continue with the attack, no more moves! (you need spring attack for this). The same happens in round 2. The key here is the ready trigger: when B attacks.

When B attacks, it means he has declared to attack (and he has already moved). Once he gets interrupted, he can't say, "no wait, i changed my mind, i no longer attack, i wanna first move another 5 ft". Because A's readied action has already happened BECAUSE he was attacking, an action that would not have happened otherwise.

Next turn B's normal movement ensures that A's little trick no longer works since A is limited to only a 5' step. In fact, attempting it again on the second turn could ONLY place A 5' away from B, at which point B takes his own 5' step and then gets a Full Attack Action against A.

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Nope; as i see it, on the second turn, they start 5 ft away from each other. A readies again, and if B moves 5ft and attemps to attack... interrupt, readied action, A moves away 5 ft. B cannot say "no, i dont attack". He already said he would. So he actually attacks an empty square and then can move, but this accomplishes nothing.

B could maybe try to charge A, because you dont declare where you charge, just that you do. So, after he got interrupted, he could continue the charge "a little further"...except B needs 10 feet to charge, and he starts his turn only 5ft away from A, so charging is an illegal action for him in the first place.

Or B could ready on his own and try to outsmart A... but i really don't see an orc with 6 int trying to outsmart anyone. And this would mean every one on one is solely decided by intelligence... which i dont think it's true.

If B is an orc with 6 int but 15 class levels, he would get defeated by A, a little 5th level fighter, because the fifth level fighter is playing with the rules, and again, this isn't very credible at all.

However, you could do better by readying against his "attack" not against his "move", so that by the time he attacks, you interrupt and step away, and get a free extra attack while he gets none. And this, since it can be done each turn, IS gamebreaking.

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No, it is not. Tactics don't break the game. Make a ranged attack or move up to the other character and if that does not rigger the ready, take a ready of your own

Readies are noticeable [mentioned in the dmg for giving in game descriptions IIRC]. You may not know what the foe is waiting for but you can see the foe is waiting for something. Having to do some guesswork to monkeywrench a foe's tactics in a duel is not bad thing.

And if you have two characters just sit for more than a few rounds with readies and counter readies just waiting for the other, just call for an initiative reroll at a time you feel fitting to determine when one sees a lapse in the other's defence.

Well, why on earth B must charge on A when he can use ranged attack, spells or other magic abilities, or simply attack another character?

Or B can just stand still and use total defense till A comes to him and attack, if B does not have any reason to kill A fast.

Madeiner said:

He cannot decide to charge, because A interrupted B based up the fact that B ATTACKED. And if B attacked, then he can only continue with the attack, no more moves! (you need spring attack for this). The same happens in round 2. The key here is the ready trigger: when B attacks.

When B attacks, it means he has declared to attack (and he has already moved). Once he gets interrupted, he can't say, "no wait, i changed my mind, i no longer attack, i wanna first move another 5 ft". Because A's readied action has already happened BECAUSE he was attacking, an action that would not have happened otherwise.



Nope; as i see it, on the second turn, they start 5 ft away from each other. A readies again, and if B moves 5ft and attemps to attack... interrupt, readied action, A moves away 5 ft. B cannot say "no, i dont attack". He already said he would. So he actually attacks an empty square and then can move, but this accomplishes nothing.

B could maybe try to charge A, because you dont declare where you charge, just that you do. So, after he got interrupted, he could continue the charge "a little further"...except B needs 10 feet to charge, and he starts his turn only 5ft away from A, so charging is an illegal action for him in the first place.

Or B could ready on his own and try to outsmart A... but i really don't see an orc with 6 int trying to outsmart anyone. And this would mean every one on one is solely decided by intelligence... which i dont think it's true.

If B is an orc with 6 int but 15 class levels, he would get defeated by A, a little 5th level fighter, because the fifth level fighter is playing with the rules, and again, this isn't very credible at all.

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Not quite as I read it.

The ready action interupts but doesn't prevent the other action.

The attack is much like receiving an AoO while charging - you can keep on charging if you survive the attack.

SRD

The action occurs just before the action that triggers it. If the triggered action is part of another character’s activities, you interrupt the other character. Assuming he is still capable of doing so, he continues his actions once you complete your readied action.

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If the subsequent 5 ft step puts the character out of range (of his movement) then the attacker is incapable of completing his action.

frankthedm said:

And if you have two characters just sit for more than a few rounds with readies and counter readies just waiting for the other, just call for an initiative reroll at a time you feel fitting to determine when one sees a lapse in the other's defence.

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An excellent point. If both characters effectively declare their intent to "wait the other out," they aren't actually in combat, and no order of initiative is needed.

Nimloth said:

A wins initiative so goes first. He readies an action: "attack B and take a 5ft step away" with trigger "as soon as he tries to attack me". Pretty standard

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Problem: You can only ready a single action.

Jack Simth said:

Problem: You can only ready a single action.

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If you have not moved on your turn at all, you're allowed to take a 5 ft step as part of your readied action (assuming the readied action itself isn't moving).

StreamOfTheSky said:

If you have not moved on your turn at all, you're allowed to take a 5 ft step as part of your readied action (assuming the readied action itself isn't moving).

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... ah, it's an explicit exception to the only one action bit. Okay.