D&D 2E [2e] Monster Mythology Update Project

AuldDragon said:

I'm actually not a fan at all of adapting human (particularly real-world) deities to non-human races. As there's no evidence of Egyptian influence on the Giff, I'd rather develop a custom god or pantheon for them. I figured they would have something with a military hierarchy.

Jeff

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Then start with Field Marshall General of Heaven and work your way down in rank from there. Petitioners are are Privates in the army of the gods...

AuldDragon said:

I'll confess, I've had no ideas about Ferrix at all yet (I tend to make notes when good ideas pop into my head, even if I'm not planning to work on a deity right away)

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Given that Ferrix is the sort of deity who makes dumb mistakes (low Wisdom), I see that as being leeway to put her into all sorts of trouble where other gods/powers are concerned. The real question is what deities and what sort of trouble...ideally something that's believable without stretching the canon too far.

and Mellifleur will be tricky since the write-up for FR's Velsharoon is such that it begs the question as to whether they are the same being or not (they share a realm for example, which you'd think liches in general, let alone lich-gods, would avoid...). Not sure how I will end up handling that.

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You know, I once remember having a conversation with someone where we discussed some circumstantial but very convincing evidence that Velsharoon and Mellifleur were not the same deity. I wish I could remember what that was now.

Insofar as sharing a realm, I was of the opinion that that was simple pragmatism on both of their parts, as both have a fairly vast force arrayed against them, and Velsharoon at least tends to make deals to try and protect himself.

There was, sadly, very little written about the religions of a LOT of the Spelljammer races (to the point that the majority seem to have NO religion), so I'd have to make the vast majority of them out of whole cloth. I've long wanted to do something unique for the Gravs and the Hurwaeti, but I haven't had any good ideas for them yet. There was a discussion on the Piazza a while back about the Dohwar, and making a "Celestial Corporation" pantheon (opposed to the Celestial Bureaucracy, of course) for them that I may get back to one day.

On a side note, I have been considering expanding the goblinoid pantheons with some lesser and demipowers to make them more well rounded, and many of them will certainly have some Spelljammer hooks.

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Personally, I'm less excited by this idea. You do a great job of sticking to the canon (albeit bending it a bit), and making up new deities whole-cloth would seem (to me, at least) like a fairly radical shift in that regard.

I much prefer to work within the existing structure of what's written and interpret that. The goblinoid pantheons have no minor gods? Perhaps because their ruling gods crush any possible challengers ahead of time (and already have enough servitors that they can comfortably keep in their thrall). Some races have no racial deities? Then approach them from that angle, and use it to make them more interesting. That's something I find far more interesting than just injecting something altogether new.

Also, kudos on the Spelljammer references. That setting doesn't get enough love.

Alzrius said:

Given that Ferrix is the sort of deity who makes dumb mistakes (low Wisdom), I see that as being leeway to put her into all sorts of trouble where other gods/powers are concerned. The real question is what deities and what sort of trouble...ideally something that's believable without stretching the canon too far.

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Oh, I know. I just haven't given it a lot of thought yet.

Alzrius said:

You know, I once remember having a conversation with someone where we discussed some circumstantial but very convincing evidence that Velsharoon and Mellifleur were not the same deity. I wish I could remember what that was now.

Insofar as sharing a realm, I was of the opinion that that was simple pragmatism on both of their parts, as both have a fairly vast force arrayed against them, and Velsharoon at least tends to make deals to try and protect himself.

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All the evidence for both cases is circumstantial. I'm probably going to pull a "who knows the truth!" thing, and allow for either possibility.

Alzrius said:

Personally, I'm less excited by this idea. You do a great job of sticking to the canon (albeit bending it a bit), and making up new deities whole-cloth would seem (to me, at least) like a fairly radical shift in that regard.

I much prefer to work within the existing structure of what's written and interpret that. The goblinoid pantheons have no minor gods? Perhaps because their ruling gods crush any possible challengers ahead of time (and already have enough servitors that they can comfortably keep in their thrall). Some races have no racial deities? Then approach them from that angle, and use it to make them more interesting. That's something I find far more interesting than just injecting something altogether new.

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All of the pantheons are canonically larger that what is listed in DMGR4. They all have lesser gods and demigods, most of whom are regional, but were not enumerated in the book. Dakarnok is an example of one of those from an early Dragon Magazine (he represents an example of an ascended kobold hero, but there are explicitly others). All I'm doing is starting from even less canon than a name.

Jeff

AuldDragon said:

All of the pantheons are canonically larger that what is listed in DMGR4. They all have lesser gods and demigods, most of whom are regional, but were not enumerated in the book. Dakarnok is an example of one of those from an early Dragon Magazine (he represents an example of an ascended kobold hero, but there are explicitly others). All I'm doing is starting from even less canon than a name.

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I don't disagree, but I think I'm looking at this slightly differently than you are.

The pantheons are certainly larger than what's in Monster Mythology. Even leaving aside (campaign) world-specific deities, there are enough other deities from various supplements, modules, magazine articles, and other places to make that fairly self-evident. However, these expansions to the existing pantheons are "canon" by their explicit reference in such material, whether by a full write-up like Dakarnok (Dragon #63) or just a name, like Refnara (Dungeon #48).

Now, there's certainly a pragmatic argument to be made in that the canon isn't some sort of holistic masterpiece, rather than a mish-mash of material across almost four decades. Likewise, there's certainly no harm (and quite a bit of fun) in going beyond it. I'm just a bit surprised, since "starting from even less canon than a name" is introducing (overt) non-canon materials (likewise, I see it as paradoxical to say "there's a canon source for introducing home-brew material"), which seems like a somewhat significant shift in how you've been operating so far.

Ilneval the Horde Leader

Time for the Orcish deity Ilneval the Horde Leader! Ilneval is a deity of war, like Gruumsh and Bahgtru, but he focuses more on the strategic and tactical aspects of war making.

Jeff

Luthic the Cave Mother

Today I have the only major female goblinoid deity, Luthic the Cave Mother. Like many female deities, she is a goddess of fertility, healing, and protection... but with a Lawful Evil orcish twist!

Jeff

Grankhul the Hunter

Next let's delve into the bugbear pantheon a bit with Grankhul the Hunter! Grankhul is a god who embodies hunting and stealth, representing ideals that sort of make him and his priests an anti-ranger.

Jeff

Kuraulyek the Horned Thief

One of the more isolated goblinkin deities, Kuraulyek the Horned Thief is an exile from the kobold pantheon. He is the creator and patron of the urd race, which are rarely used and had very little information written about them, so I had a fairly wide open slate to work from. Enjoy!

Jeff

Shargaas the Night Lord

One of two loners amongst the orcish pantheon, Shargaas the Night Lord is master of those acts that are best performed in darkness, the underdark, and darkness in general. He has is patron of those professions that are best performed in the darkness such as thievery and assassination. Enjoy!

Jeff

AuldDragon said:

One of two loners amongst the orcish pantheon, Shargaas the Night Lord is master of those acts that are best performed in darkness, the underdark, and darkness in general. He has is patron of those professions that are best performed in the darkness such as thievery and assassination. Enjoy!

Jeff

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AuldDragon, another excellent entry! As a big fan of your work, I'm glad you're still running with this.

A minor note, the seventh bullet point under the entry for shadowblade special abilities refers to them as "nightblades."

Also, I notice that you include a smattering of scro worshippers among the racial entries for orc deities. I have to wonder how true that'd actually be, given that the scro have, as a society, rejected the "old gods" in favor of Dukagsh.

Even if there are some heretics among scro society (which is unlikely, given the totalitarian nature of Dukagsh's religion, but still possible), it's hard to imagine them actually becoming worshippers to the point of receiving divine benefits (e.g. clerical magic)...at least while in Dukagshspace (see Dragon Annual #1 ); heretic scro in other crystal spheres are still possible.

I say that because it's implied (albeit never stated outright) that Dukagsh is the only deity with a connection to that crystal sphere (though it helps that he actually dwells within it, rather than another plane), and so other deities simply can't grant clerical benefits to priests there...it's highly unlikely that the scro military would allow for a temple to a foreign god to exist within their crystal sphere for a year, which (IIRC) is how long it takes a foreign god to establish themselves in a new sphere.

[/nerd-rant]