[Spoilers] Help with a campaign arc idea.

So, me and some friends play DnD. I used to DM, but got kind of burned out on that a while back, so I'm playing a char now in one of their campaigns. However, I'd like to finish up the story I had, but I'm kind of stuck.

The players are level 14. They are a Paladin (Bahamut, Hospitaler), Ranger (Melora, Battlefield Archer), Warlord (Corellon, Knight Commander), Fighter (Moradin, Pit Fighter) and Invoker (I think Kord, don't know PP as he basically started playing DnD at the time and only has 2 sessions in this campaign).

I used the Last Breaths of Ashenport module, which ended up with them now owning Ashenport, a small coastal town, and appointing Terza (Female Elven Ashenport NPC Bow Ranger which they saved) to its rule.

My players are not RPers at all and kind of forget quest objectives. So I want something they can easily remember as a goal. So I want to have Terza abducted by Orcus or Tiamat or some other evil deity.

When we left off, they were stomping around in the Underdark for P2 Demon Queens Enclave.

I want to finish it up within a decent timeframe, so I was considering ending the campaign at 20 or basically levelbumping them from 18 to 24-28 or something. Deity battles are probably not a good idea at 20, so If I want to use the arc where they rescue Terza and then slay a god, I'd have to bump them.

But for plot:
The players come back to Ashenport, where they talk with Terza about the town and everything, buy some gear and then get sent off to kill a cult of Orcus some time away. Terza gives them this quest, and she got it in the tavern where a cultist in disguise told her the information (I have to work out why and how this happened).

When they arrive or return (don't know yet), they find out Terza's abducted.

They have to go get her. When they do find her (after around 6 encouters or so?) she's shackled to a wall, not moving. As soon as they touch her she dries out and crumbles to ashes and they hear a laughter. Since my players are video game nerds, I'd probably have a Magic Mouth say "I'm sorry but your princess is in another castle".

This happens 2 or 3 times I think.
During this time, would it be a good idea to create something of a Council of the Five (the deities of the players, theres a reason I listed them above) and give them boons? They are fighting against a shared enemy and I think it would be suitably epic if they showed up and gave them stuff.

Then they fight the deity with Terza suspended in a bubble in the air. Each portion of hitpoints the bubble weakens and she can move more and more of her body (starting with stuff like fingers, then bigger limbs).

So, please critique the ideas. Is this suitably epic? Would you do something different?
Summary of questions:
Is it a good idea to bump a mid paragon party to mid-end epic to fight a god?
What deity would be a good choice for this? Orcus? Tiamat?
Would Orcus or Tiamat take hostages? And let them live?
Would the players deities intervene in a combat and give them boons?
What kind of boons? Magic items? Untyped bonuses to hit and damage?

It sounds very frustrating to me, but maybe other people would like it. I don't like linear adventures (you must do X, then Y, then Z) much to start with, and when they involve repeated failures that doesn't seem like fun at all.

S'mon said:

It sounds very frustrating to me, but maybe other people would like it. I don't like linear adventures (you must do X, then Y, then Z) much to start with, and when they involve repeated failures that doesn't seem like fun at all.

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Ok. My players aren't really people who explore the area or look for things to do, so I kind of have to railroad them for them to do anything.

Its annoying for me too.

However, I'll keep in mind the repeated failures. Maybe I'll do it only once, because I do like the idea of her being an illusion and crumbling.

A bump in PC ability without a corresponding understanding of those abilities will make a difficult fight very difficult. If you're burned out, I recommend just not continuing. Otherwise, you'll wind up with a sub-par game that no one enjoys anyway. Regardless, my opinion is that you need to be level 30 to have a prayer of fighting a deity. Basically, the whole thing reeks of railroading just to fake an "endgame" encounter, and as a player I'd be pretty annoyed at it all. I definitely wouldn't have fun and would just prefer to play the new game instead.

My only recommendation is to finish P2. At least then the players (and you) will have a sense of accomplishment that isn't forced (and crap). P2 is a really good module, so if that's not going well for you, then no sense in continuing.

Infiniti2000 said:

A bump in PC ability without a corresponding understanding of those abilities will make a difficult fight very difficult. If you're burned out, I recommend just not continuing. Otherwise, you'll wind up with a sub-par game that no one enjoys anyway. Regardless, my opinion is that you need to be level 30 to have a prayer of fighting a deity. Basically, the whole thing reeks of railroading just to fake an "endgame" encounter, and as a player I'd be pretty annoyed at it all. I definitely wouldn't have fun and would just prefer to play the new game instead.

My only recommendation is to finish P2. At least then the players (and you) will have a sense of accomplishment that isn't forced (and crap). P2 is a really good module, so if that's not going well for you, then no sense in continuing.

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I'd like that idea best, but one of my players basically wanted an end to the story. Perhaps I can indeed just finish P2 and they all live happily ever after.

Without knowing your players, it is a bit difficult to really say since all groups are different. However, the mention of wanting to get "the end of the story" does suggest that at least one of the players is interested in the story and/or roleplay aspects of the game.

With that in mind, here are the problems I see (in no particular order):

1. The storyline definitely seems like a bit of a railroad. This can be fixed pretty easily, but admittedly you are in a bit of a bind considering you are trying to finish it up real quick.

2. Why does the evil deity want Terza to begin with? What is it about this relatively minor NPC that is so important? Is she simply a means to get at the PCs?

3. Without a clear distinction as to why the evil deity wants Terza, why would the good deities care either? How will Terza being the captive of the evil deity screw things up? There is, after all, a reason why the good deities haven't banded together to try to destroy the evil ones (and vice versa frankly). In other words, the stakes likely need to be really big in order to convince the deities to become involved.

Now, with that in mind, perhaps a possible explanation is that the evil deity has found a way to use a mortal shell to get around the restriction of the deities being able to walk in the material plane. At the conclusion of the Dawn War, the deities basically agreed not to take any direct action on the material plane (if I recall correctly). Perhaps inhabiting the mortal shell (after an appropriate ritual, etc.) will enable the evil deity to do that which the rest of the gods cannot. From there the evil deity can attack the good deities through their faithful, systematically wiping out the temples and churches of the other deities. Perhaps, the power of the gods comes not from the gods themselves, but rather from those who worship them. Perhaps gods die as a result of not having worshippers and this is why so many deities have simply faded into memory.

Now, you have a reason for the deity to take Terza AND you have a reason for the good deities to get involved.

Now, as for which deity makes the most sense, I would go with Lloth if for not other reasons than a) you are already running P2 and b) she absolutely loves her some chaos and a world without gods would certainly create some chaos.

Vadriar said:

I'd like that idea best, but one of my players basically wanted an end to the story. Perhaps I can indeed just finish P2 and they all live happily ever after.

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I'm not familiar with the plot of P2 but could you alter it to create a connection to things that the players care about (Terza, Ashenport, Council of the Five, etc.)? The encounters and flow of P2 could stay exactly the same but if you can edit it so the goal is saving Terza and Ashenport from destruction it could give the campaign the sort of closure your player wants that won't be found if their goal is to beat a Demon Queen.

Raistlin, that is a great idea.

1) It is a bit of a railroad, but that is not really a requirement. I just want to be able to finish it within say 20-30 3-4 hour sessions. It took them over 2,5 years of weekly sessions (lets say with all the times we skipped that's over 90 sessions) to get to 14. They really like the tactical aspect of the game, not so much the lore and plot part. I just don't want it to drag on for another 2+ years for them to trundle to level 30.
(After I handed the DM screen to someone else I thought I should just hand out more magic items and just make them do more damage, and just totally allow stuff like frostcheese, just so encounters go faster. I had discouraged (but not banned) the use of frostcheese and similar stuff before)

2) I got the idea from P2 itself -- This luitenant of Orcus wants some powerful souls and so creates a reason for the heroes to go there. This time, Deity wants powerful souls (or just them) and uses Terza (which they care about) to get to them. She's the NPC they like the most and about the only one they'll care for (shows how much this group can not roleplay themselves out of a paper bag, probably me included). It's not that I haven't tried, I've introduced fellows like Barton (Five League House, as played by Chris Perkins), Nathan Feringray, Vadriar (from H2, guess where I got my name for this forum) and the mages of Saruun. They just instantly forget them. It might be my fault for not RPing them right, but whatever the cause they just won't stick.

So Terza is the only one I feel they'll go rescue without there being a quest reward.

3) At this point, the characters are on the way to Demigod-hood. I think this is pretty rare, and even rarer that 5 persons do so at the same time for the same (rough) alignment. Maybe evilDeity thinks that good will gain too much power from this and wants to stop it?

Honestly, my players wouldn't even ask the questions you asked. Not that I don't appreciate your answer -- I do -- but they haven't really cared much for lore, which is one of the things that makes me wary of going into Epic tier.

I like your lore reason for it, and I probably will use it if this comes to fruition.

You know, you could have the final battle against an aspect of Orcus: that's a level 24 brute, so if you dropped in some mooks of equal level you'd be looking at an appropriately tough fight for a bunch of level 20 PCs.

You could also reason that killing the aspect throws Orcus himself into some centuries' long torpor - so it's like they've banished him, which is still a fairly epic end to the campaign.

It's also just the sort of deed that could set them on the path to being Demigods.