Eladrin, why?

Shroomy · Jan 4, 2012

Mengu said:
Depends on how you count... There is Elf, Eladrin, Drow, Half-elf. Then there is Sun Elf, Moon Elf, Wild Elf, Wood Elf (respectively eladrin and elf variants). Then there are Revenant elves of all sorts. Then there is the short tricksy elves who call themselves gnomes, and the even shorter elves with wings, who call themselves pixies. If the tree hugging elf trope is not enough for you there is also now the tree hugger elf supreme, the Hamadryad, and the elf who grew barkskin and became the mobile tree, the Wilden. And while it's not a race per se, we can have vampire elves of all sorts, not to mention gypsy elves, and shadow elves, and christmas elves. You even have to be an elf to become a Sith Lord (though they use the elven spelling, Sidhe). I think we pretty much have elves coming out of our ears.

And here I thought humans were supposed to be the most diverse race... They are all turning werewolf these days. Yawn. At least their skin doesn't sparkle.

Aquatic elves have been mentioned in 4e sources, but not officially stated, and lets not forget the dusk elf or winterkin eladrin.

Spatula · Jan 4, 2012

TerraDave said:
No

Well, yes. High/grey elves have been in D&D since the early days. They usually weren't a PC race and weren't called eladrin (and eladrin referred to something else entirely), but they have always been there.

havard said:
I actually thought this was a design feature rather than a flaw in 3E. The fact that the ability score modifiers suggested a rogue/Ranger type and the favored class was Wizard meant that the Elf would indeed do well with either option, just as intended.

Favored class in 3e doesn't mean that elves make good wizards, though. It doesn't mean anything unless you multiclass, and then it only says, "you can dip into wizard, or be a wizard and dip into another class, without penalty." But actually doing so would probably be a mistake, in terms of character effectiveness anyway, given the multiclassing issues with spellcasters.

Multiclassing issues aside, the favored class mechanics were probably a good way to model in 3e how elves had typically been portrayed in D&D in the past: not as the best wizards (1e capped them at level 11, I think), but as being a combo of wizard and something else (fighter, thief, fighter/thief, etc.). Which is to say, that most elves would know some magic.

TerraDave · Jan 4, 2012

Spatula said:
Well, yes. High/grey elves have been in D&D since the early days. They usually weren't a PC race and weren't called eladrin (and eladrin referred to something else entirely), but they have always been there.

No, again.

I was referring to "Eladrin", but in terms of high elves, they were always the explicit default until 4E. In OD&D and B/X D&D all elves could cast wizard spells (thought the way it worked in OD&D was really confusing) and were more high/grey then woodsy. High remained the default through 1E, 2E, and 3E. The wood/sylvan/wild elves were the option, starting with the 1E monster manual and getting stated up for players in Unearthed Arcana. (which also gave us drow as a player race, which could fight with two weapons, which led to Drizzt and a total munchkin build with the way 1E rangers added damage to their attacks, which led to two weapon rangers...but I digress).

Klaus · Jan 4, 2012

Shroomy said:
Aquatic elves have been mentioned in 4e sources, but not officially stated, and lets not forget the dusk elf or winterkin eladrin.

One of the Nerathi Legends article (Merindalion, Barony of the Emerald Blade, IIRC) had a feat for half-elves with an aquatic heritage.

Argyle King · Jan 5, 2012

Depending on how you look at it, there are more varieties of human than there are varieties of elf in 4E.

PHB1

Human
Half-Elf
Tiefling

3

vs

Elf
Half-Elf
Eladrin

3

tie

Other sources I'm aware of
Vrykola (human)
Half-Orc (can be said to be human)
Kalashtar (psionic humans)
Mul (half-dwarf)

Drow (elf)

Humans 7 - Elves 4

It could be argued that Mul and Kalashtar shouldn't count due to being setting specific. In that case, humans edge out elves 5 to 4.

MrBeens · Jan 5, 2012

Mengu said:
Depends on how you count... There is Elf, Eladrin, Drow, Half-elf. Then there is Sun Elf, Moon Elf, Wild Elf, Wood Elf (respectively eladrin and elf variants). Then there are Revenant elves of all sorts. Then there is the short tricksy elves who call themselves gnomes, and the even shorter elves with wings, who call themselves pixies. If the tree hugging elf trope is not enough for you there is also now the tree hugger elf supreme, the Hamadryad, and the elf who grew barkskin and became the mobile tree, the Wilden. And while it's not a race per se, we can have vampire elves of all sorts, not to mention gypsy elves, and shadow elves, and christmas elves. You even have to be an elf to become a Sith Lord (though they use the elven spelling, Sidhe). I think we pretty much have elves coming out of our ears.

And here I thought humans were supposed to be the most diverse race... They are all turning werewolf these days. Yawn. At least their skin doesn't sparkle.

Then you have the short stocky hairy elves who call themselves dwarves, the short fat less hairy ones who call themselves halflings, the elves that went to live in the elemental chaos and called themselves Genasi etc. :erm:

Zaran · Jan 6, 2012

Which elves are good at making cookies?

tuxgeo · Jan 8, 2012

Zaran said:
Which elves are good at making cookies?

Man, this straight-line has been sitting here untouched for over a day?
(Is it that close to the Egress?)

I don't think it's the Keebler elves; those guys all got booted up into middle management at about the time the Kellogg company acquired their operation. (That, or they had their positions eliminated for efficiency.)
Sure, they still have an older guy as a spokes-elf; but they had to animate all of his footage in order to avoid showing his wrinkles.

The cookies of the Keebler brand are probably made on a modern, automated production line these days--nothing like the older, hand-made delights of yesteryear.

Axios_Verum · May 15, 2017

Actually, the Keebler elves and Christmas elves are the same elves. But this is where it gets interesting: both elves are derived from the nordic svartalfar, black-skinned elves who were crafty and smaller than the ljosalfar, the light-elves. So the Keebler and Christmas elves are actually Drow in disguise.