Pathfinder 1E Question: Can a Bard cast a spell while maintaining a bardic performance?

doghead

thotd

• Jan 31, 2013

• #1

A player in my game asked if his character (Bard 1) could both cast a spell (Dancing Lights with VS components) while maintaining his Bard Performance (Inspire Courage using his Sing skill).

I looked through the rules but couldn't find anything.

So usually I would just go with what feels right. But there seem to be reasonable arguments for both answers in this case.

No - you cannot sing and conduct other verbal activities at the same time.

Yes - Bardic performaces don't have a set lyrics or tunes. Each bard will do them differently. The words and gestures of the spell can be woven into the performance.

In light of this, and the philosophy of "Say yes or roll the dice", my inclination is to go with "roll the dice" and allow it with a successful Perform check vs DC20 + Spell level.

However, before I made any decision, I thought I would ask here to see if I was missing anything. In particular I was concerned about unforeseen consequences.

Cheers

thotd

 

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S

Sorenson

Explorer

• Jan 31, 2013

• #2

According to RAW you only need to be able to perform a free action to maintain the performance. It makes no mention of whatever else you might be doing while using that free action.

 

P

paradox42

First Post

• Jan 31, 2013

• #3

Certainly you can cast while maintaining a Performance. It's not even necessary to make a roll; you're making things too restrictive for the character by requiring that. As Sorenson noted, maintaining a Performance is a free action, so it costs the Bard nothing to do it (aside from spending another round out of the daily limit). In fact, for proof that this is exactly what the designers intended, see the list of spells from the APG and Ultimate Magic that actually require the Bard to be in the middle of a Performance in order to even cast them in the first place. I'm including links to three of them below.

Allegro
Purging Finale
Virtuoso Performance

 

Scott DeWar

Prof. Emeritus-Supernatural Events/Countermeasure

• Feb 1, 2013

• #4

For the record,
1) I am the player in question
2) Doghead isn't forcing me
3) I volunteered the roll.

I have only played A D and D first ed bards [the ones that require fighter 7, thief 8, druid studies from there on] So wasn't sure.

 

ObsoleteAccount_2

First Post

• Feb 9, 2013

• #5

I have played a bard for a while and he sang (performance) his spells that he casted... quite funny he also made remarks (boost morale) also funny another way of doing two things at the same time is like dancing (if thats the performance you do) and using a blade.

 

MoonSong

Rules-lawyering drama queen but not a munchkin

• Feb 9, 2013

• #6

Well in 3.5 it was possible to use bardic performance and cast at the same time, you just had to time it right. Masterwork instrument + somatic weaponry/still spell + Eschew materials equals perform and cast at the same time.

 

ObsoleteAccount_2

First Post

• Feb 9, 2013

• #7

oh and for the record.. i'm also running games ... i would find it more important if a player could imagine how it would work and describe it rather then the "official rules say this or that" having the game progressing ... if i wsnt to play a game dictated by rules i play something like d&d online

but thats my way of thinking and playing/running games...

 

Starfox

Hero

• Feb 9, 2013

• #8

This is a pretty big change in Pathfinder from 3.5. In 3.5 it was hard or impossible to do, in Pathfinder it is bread and butter. The backside is that a bard can never keep more than one bardic performance going - previously you could cause them to overlap trough various tricks.

 

Nigh Invulnerable

First Post

• Feb 21, 2013

• #9

Scott DeWar said:

For the record,
1) I am the player in question
2) Doghead isn't forcing me
3) I volunteered the roll.

I have only played A D and D first ed bards [the ones that require fighter 7, thief 8, druid studies from there on] So wasn't sure.

Click to expand...

I think it's cool you were fine with the improv ruling, but going forward you guys should know that maintaining the performance is a free action, which you get one per round and it has no impact on your other actions (for the most part). I'd fluff it by saying that the bard who is singing to inspire courage, or competence, or whatever, simply incorporates the spell words into his song during that round and casts while maintaining the performance. Maybe that doesn't make sense, but I'd justify it that way as the DM in my group.

 

doghead

thotd

• Feb 21, 2013

• #10

Thanks for your input.

In the end I went with Perform Check vs DC10+Spell level, which is a fairly low bar for a Bard. In this case, the Bard 1 had +9 on his check.

I understand that maintaining a Bardic Performance is a Free action, and casting a spell is a Standard action, so according to the RAW, both can be done in the same Round. However, as both involve singing it seemed to me that an element of incompatibility existed which some level of skill was required to overcome. Hence the perform check.

thotd