Tell me about STAR WARS: EDGE OF EMPIRE

Gundark said:

Well, FFG made the decision (or maybe Disney/Lucasfilm made them) to focus on the rebellion era of Star Wars. The closest that you can get to Jedis is what Luke would have looked like in episode 4 and the beginning of episode 5. I can understand how this is a sticking point for some people.

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That also means they are ignoring the expanded universe. This is a very small period of time in the Star Wars sagas. It is also the most wrote about with RPGs. It's giving me the option of playing in one time period and the same time period that all the other Star Wars games gives me. As far as I can see this game isn't giving me anything new.

The book weighs in @ 437 pages while Saga edition had 285. There is a lot of stuff in EotE and calling it incomplete is like calling Saga Edition incomplete. Saga took a kitchen sink a approach which left it feeling far from complete too.

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Well, I know if I ask people to play Stars Wars some will want to play a Jedi. That's the most famous character concept from the setting. Without Jedi I might as well play Serenity, or Traveler, or Ashen Stars, or another science fiction space game. Without knowing how those 437 pages are used just listing page numbers proves nothing. But with almost twice the page count and I'll assume larger pages since the Saga books were smaller one would hope that it would be able to do everything Saga did but a hell of a lot more. That's obviously not the case.

That also means they are ignoring the expanded universe. This is a very small period of time in the Star Wars sagas. It is also the most wrote about with RPGs. It's giving me the option of playing in one time period and the same time period that all the other Star Wars games gives me. As far as I can see this game isn't giving me anything new.

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Specifically they are not ignoring the Expanded Universe. Page 295 has a little sidebar in terms of using the EU (or not). Many of the starships presented in the book are clearly EU (the YT-2400, for example). They make reference to the vast resources that the EU presents, and they acknowledge that there is lots more material than they can cover in this book.

As for the Jedi, this was a choice they made that their treatment of the Jedi/Sith will receive the 440+ book treatment in the third major installment of the game (Force and Destiny). They don't leave you hanging completely, as the Force Sensitive Specialization represents how to have a Jedi-type character in a time where Jedi have been essentially exterminated. It is possible to start building a character that will eventually become a full-fledged Jedi as the newer books come out. They've even included a sample "Forsaken Jedi" as a potential advesary/ally who has low-end to moderate force powers.

As for Edge of the Empire, there's nothing saying you couldn't extrapolate what's in the book to something you might see in KoTOR or in the prequels. Criminal elements and people living on the fringe are indeed ubiquitous, and that can fit in any era. The map of the galaxy that they provide, including various notable locations presume a post-Yavin, pre-Hoth galaxy, but they do include details of what that world/environment was like prior to the rise of the Empire. There's certainly enough in the book to play in any of the eras in a criminal/underworld/fringe theme. Although it is true that we will need to wait until 2015 until the Jedi/Sith get an entire book dedicated to them.

What I am experiencing in this book is the first step in what is going to be a hugely in-depth and great narrative-style roleplaying game. No game is complete at first release, and it's completely unrealistic for us to expect that.

Crothian said:

That also means they are ignoring the expanded universe. This is a very small period of time in the Star Wars sagas. It is also the most wrote about with RPGs. It's giving me the option of playing in one time period and the same time period that all the other Star Wars games gives me. As far as I can see this game isn't giving me anything new.
Well, I know if I ask people to play Stars Wars some will want to play a Jedi. That's the most famous character concept from the setting. Without Jedi I might as well play Serenity, or Traveler, or Ashen Stars, or another science fiction space game. Without knowing how those 437 pages are used just listing page numbers proves nothing. But with almost twice the page count and I'll assume larger pages since the Saga books were smaller one would hope that it would be able to do everything Saga did but a hell of a lot more. That's obviously not the case.

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I can understand how not having Jedi Is a big deal for people so I get a lot of people's complaints.I don't fully know, but didn't WEG Star Wars not allow Jedi as well? I talked about page numbers to illustrate that the book is big and for the era it covers Is covered pretty in-depth. By contrast the core Saga book left a ton of holes that required GMs to fill in. There are merits to both approaches.I Just think that people are not being fair to EotE

Gundark said:

I can understand how not having Jedi Is a big deal for people so I get a lot of people's complaints.I don't fully know, but didn't WEG Star Wars not allow Jedi as well? I talked about page numbers to illustrate that the book is big and for the era it covers Is covered pretty in-depth. By contrast the core Saga book left a ton of holes that required GMs to fill in. There are merits to both approaches.I Just think that people are not being fair to EotE

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I think jedi was in d6 from the first version but I'd need to open up the book to check. But unlike d6 this game is competing with other versions of Star Wars. One thing that made Saga work is it was a toolkit and not a lot of setting. It's Star Wars, most people don't need a lot of setting information they already know it. I'm not sure many people will need 50 pages on Tatooine or what ever setting is in there.

Jedi were in d6 Star Wars from the start, but like this version it explicitly called them out as rare, you started with very limited powers and it was really hard to improve, or learn new abilities, as finding a teacher was up to the GM. If anything it was harder than FFGs version to improve.

There is one page on Tatoonie.... I think a lot of the setting information is pretty useful, and about stuff most people won't have picked up from watching the films. Stuff on the Hutts, Black Suns, trade routes, imperial law. Stuff you need to run a smuggler, outer-rim style game.

i also think there are some rules that might not show up in the other versions, like Obligations, which are a key part of this game, but wouldn't fit the theme of a Rebellion campaign as much, I suspect some other mechanic for tracking the effect the player have on advancing the rebel cause might be introduced in the next book.

but yeah you have to wonder how much will need to be reprinted for each core book.

In terms of what will be reprinted for each core book, obviously anything around the dice and mechanics, as well as a descriptor for handling combat and play. I'd expect most of the equipment to remain the same, with some changes in terms of starfighters and star ships. Example: Y-Wings and Z-95 headhunters are present in EoTE, but X-Wings, A-Wings and B-Wings are not. Likely because the characters are far more likely to encounter these ships in EoTE games, whereas X-Wings are far newer and rarer than the venerable spacecraft here. If I am to guess, future books will be approximately 30 pages will be repeats of the base rules, likely 50 pages of gear will be very similar, about 27 pages for handling combat/conflict. Some of the starship rules will be repeated of course, but the selection of craft will be different. My best guess is that out of the 440+ pages the next two books will have, about 100-120 pages will be effectively reprints... so you can likely count on 320-340 pages of new material with each book.

I remember buying the original 1st edition Greg Costikyan game from WEG, and while Jedi were do-able, they were really more like the Force Sensitives already present in the new game. Additionally, characters couldn't progress without having a master, which in the Empire period was nearly impossible. At least in the new game, Force-sensitive characters can spend their XP on advancing their force powers. I'd have to check, there's an off chance I may actually still have that original book buried someplace (and now I am dating myself)...

To the credit of the original WEG Star Wars, we wouldn't have the Expanded Universe without it. I was impressed to see that the new game has largely been built on that material in terms of background and content. Wookiepedia will be your friend with this game.

a) There will be a whole game about Jedi in the upcoming future. Edge of Empire has always been explicitly about low level fringers and smugglers. Complaining about no Jedi is akin to complaining about no Space Marines in Dark Heresy.

b) The feel of the original Trilogy was that, indeed, Jedi were rare and those few that did pop up were hunted to the brink of extinction. It's an important theme in the originals of the notion of the Force being held as an ancient 'religion' that most people don't believe in anymore (ask Han Solo!) being confounded by the 'new hope' in the potential development of Force sensitive Luke Skywalker. Even then, there weren't any real Jedi until the 3rd movie - hence "Return of the Jedi" - unless you consider the fading, aging Obi-Wan or Yoda (that were almost of NPC status in gaming terms by this point).

c) Star Wars doesn't need powergaming to be a successful game.

How much expanded universe is in there?

If anything I'd say the book really does presume much of what's in the expanded universe as its overall foundation. The difficulty is, in the book it doesn't specifically say "this is EU and this is not" especially when describing the Galaxy. However, there's lots of material here that is certainly not present in the films in terms of the various worlds and sections of the galaxy. There is reasonably detailed map of the galaxy that includes places like the Corporate Sector, Hutt Space. It shows the area of space that (will) be controlled by the Imperial Remnant around 40 ABY. It shows the various major and minor trade routes through the galaxy as well.

In terms of aircraft/spacecraft, there's a good mix of "Canon" and "EU" material. The trast heavy speeder truck, for example is clearly an EU item that is covered in Wookiepedia and has only ever been in RPG supplements. Spacecraft wise, the Cloakshape Fighter, the Jumpmaster 5000 Long-range Scout, Skipray Blastboat are just a few that are EU. In fact, I'd almost say in the Starship section, it's at least 50/50 Canon and EU in terms of equipment. The nice thing is, the stats are flexible enough that if you wanted to, extrapolating ships that aren't in the book would not be hard.

I think the note in regard to the Expanded Universe on page 295 is more in relation to how much or how little GMs might want to stick with the Star Wars canon, or how "off script" they want to go. The material in EoTE certainly presumes the EU, and so far nothing I've come across in the book explicitly contradicts anything that I've cross-referenced in Wookiepedia.

What is it that separates this version of Star Wars from the others? Someone mentions something called Obligation so what is that in these rules and how does that work?