Bitcoin debacle: 850,000 bitcoins gone or half a billions dollars

Kramodlog · Feb 28, 2014

Derren said:
Except that gold is real and also has industrial applications (including jewelry).

Bitcoins are real. I also point to a guy who makes them physical if you wanna focus on that.

Bitcoins are a complete fantasy product.

No more than regular money. It has vey little value, it the value we attribute it that turns it into glorified toilet paper or cigar lither.

Derren · Feb 28, 2014

goldomark said:
Bitcoins are real. I also point to a guy who makes them physical if you wanna focus on that.
No more than regular money. It has vey little value, it the value we attribute it that turns it into glorified toilet paper or cigar lither.

Wrong.
Bitcoins are a collection of magnetic or electrical signals. 1 and 0 with no real world presence, no matter if you put a plastic casing around them or not.

Real money has the backing of the country issuing them. So in a way it represents a small fraction of its industrial, diplomatic and military power.

Kramodlog · Feb 28, 2014

Derren said:
Wrong.
Bitcoins are a collection of magnetic or electrical signals. 1 and 0 with no real world presence, no matter if you put a plastic casing around them or not.

It doesn't mean it is not real money.

Real money has the backing of the country issuing them.

Yes, I mentioned this as a weakness of bitcoins, but it does make them less real money.

So in a way it represents a small fraction of its industrial, diplomatic and military power.

How is this relevent to it being real money?

Derren · Feb 28, 2014

goldomark said:
How is this relevent to it being real money?

Because this gives money value. It links them to physical objects. It also ensures that there is someone who stands behind the currency and vouches for it.
Bitcoins have nothing of that. They are the tulips of our time (only worse) only kept aloft by rampant speculation, some crime and anti government conspiracy theorist who have preached the imminent end of the economic system for decades.

Kramodlog · Mar 1, 2014

Derren said:
Because this gives money value.

You're talking about things that influence the perception people will have of the currency. Bitcoin is no different perception affects its value. It does affect whether it is a currency or not.

[qute]It links them to physical objects.[/quote]Money doesn't need that to be a currency.

It also ensures that there is someone who stands behind the currency and vouches for it.

That affect its value, but not the fact that its a currency or not.

They are the tulips of our time (only worse) only kept aloft by rampant speculation, some crime and anti government conspiracy theorist who have preached the imminent end of the economic system for decades.

Which doesn't mean it is not a currency. It means it is a currency for criminals cause they give it value.

bone_naga · Mar 1, 2014

Our currency, our government, and our society all work on mutual agreement. A few dissidents here and there and it still tends to work out ok, but if enough people stop playing, it collapses. It doesn't matter if you're talking gold, paper currency, bitcoins, or chickens, it has the value we give it as a collective group and that value only lasts for as long as we choose to recognize it.

Kramodlog · Mar 1, 2014

bone_naga said:
Our currency, our government, and our society all work on mutual agreement. A few dissidents here and there and it still tends to work out ok, but if enough people stop playing, it collapses. It doesn't matter if you're talking gold, paper currency, bitcoins, or chickens, it has the value we give it as a collective group and that value only lasts for as long as we choose to recognize it.

Ours or how much an elite weights in?

Zombie_Babies · Mar 3, 2014

Umbran said:
Well, I think it might be an inaccurate statement.

The coffee itself has tangible value (for a while, while it is still hot and fresh, at least - that tangible value is transient). That does not mean that someone taking bitcoin to give you coffee means the bitcoin represents tangible value, any more than it means the coffee represents bitcoin. There was an instance where I literally sang for my supper - I exchanged a song for a meal. Does that song now represent tangible value? Hardly.

Lacking something like a gold standard, forms of currency represent tangible value only insofar as we all agree they do. Sure, maybe you can buy a coffee. But can you buy all your groceries and pay your utility bills with it? Then, I question how tangible a value they represent. Their applicability was still too undependable, I'm afraid.

Of course, "currency" isn't actually solidly defined in the first place, so opinions will vary.

That's not a statement contradicting my assertion. Rather, it's a statement of agreement with a caveat: degree.

Umbran · Mar 3, 2014

goldomark said:
It doesn't mean it is not real money.

Well, money is like the velveteen rabbit. It has to be loved enough before it can be real.

Bitcoin, I think, hasn't reached that stage yet. Too may (meaning, most of the planet) still question its validity, and won't accept it.

Plus, Bitcoin's target was to have a single bitcoin be worth tens of thousands of dollars. This makes it an unreasonable choice as a currency for everyday use by individuals.

Derren · Mar 3, 2014

Umbran said:
This makes it an unreasonable choice as a currency for everyday use by individuals.

And thats not the only thing. How do you handle bitcoins in the physical world? We still need several decades until digital transactions and mobile phone wallets are the norm and so common that they replace hard currency for most people.

Bitcoin debacle: 850,000 bitcoins gone or half a billions dollars

Kramodlog

Naked and living in a barrel

Derren

Hero

Kramodlog

Naked and living in a barrel

Derren

Hero

Kramodlog

Naked and living in a barrel

bone_naga

Explorer

Kramodlog

Naked and living in a barrel

Zombie_Babies

First Post

Umbran

Mod Squad

Derren

Hero

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