FormerlyHemlock
Hero
Clerics, druids, and bards can do this too, via Planar Binding. The only full caster who can't is the sorcerer, actually, or a Valor Bard who doesn't have anyone to cast Conjure Elemental for him.
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D&D 5E Treantmonk's Guide to Wizards 5e
Clerics, druids, and bards can do this too, via Planar Binding. The only full caster who can't is the sorcerer, actually, or a Valor Bard who doesn't have anyone to cast Conjure Elemental for him.
I don't know what you're talking about. A rule quotation would be helpful.
Zapp means he will kill a player's idea to regain unlimited hit points by ruling that chickens do not provide sufficient means to activate the effect. Since 5E actively encourages DMs to destroy any exploits such as killing chickens to gain as many hit points as the number of chickens he can drag around a dungeon, it is considered the rules.
Myself? I would allow you to do it. I would create other ways of making it inconvenient such as the providing enough feed to keep the chickens alive. Asking where you're carrying them given the absence of easily obtainable magic bags. Having chicken or small animal shortages in regions you are at after a few forays into chicken or rat buying. I'd make you role-play catching rats or the like limiting the number you can carry. Plenty of very legitimate ways to limit the capacity of someone to carry around a ready supply of small animals to kill for hit points. Not to mention it would be funny to see some rat or chicken killing necromancer being known as the local vermin or poultry vampire. Have people showing up at your door and filling your room with rodents and chickens, having their feces all about the room and you stinking of rat or chicken all the time. It would be a fun running joke.
FormerlyHemlock
Hero
Myself? I would allow you to do it. I would create other ways of making it inconvenient such as the providing enough feed to keep the chickens alive. Asking where you're carrying them given the absence of easily obtainable magic bags. Having chicken or small animal shortages in regions you are at after a few forays into chicken or rat buying. I'd make you role-play catching rats or the like limiting the number you can carry. Plenty of very legitimate ways to limit the capacity of someone to carry around a ready supply of small animals to kill for hit points. Not to mention it would be funny to see some rat or chicken killing necromancer being known as the local vermin or poultry vampire. Have people showing up at your door and filling your room with rodents and chickens, having their feces all about the room and you stinking of rat or chicken all the time. It would be a fun running joke.
Oh yeah, absolutely. I would expect you to do this. Chicken-hassle has been a major part of the fun in games I've played with necromancers, even ones who don't even know Vampiric Touch yet but are planning to learn how to sacrifice chickens to the Dark Gods of Life Drain when they hit 5th level. Whether it's buying chickens, shepherding chickens away from wolves, or responding to a wererat attack by casually tossing a live chicken on the flames of a burning house (horrifying the other PCs who don't realize that it's an act of hunger and not pique), chickens have been awesome so far and I would expect that to apply in other games as well. But at least they are cheap, and they breed quickly, so it's only hassle and not a prohibitive expense like healing potions are.
Clerics, druids, and bards can do this too, via Planar Binding. The only full caster who can't is the sorcerer, actually, or a Valor Bard who doesn't have anyone to cast Conjure Elemental for him.
Few does mean more than one class. Bards take such spells at the loss of other slots. They can't change spells between levels, so it can be costly for them. They don't have gate and would have to take magic circle and planar binding with only 22 to 24 spell slots along with other conjuration spells.
Druid and cleric can do it. Cleric may spend his money on planar ally depending on how amenable the GM is to providing a sufficiently powerful ally cheap. Druid can conjure creatures, but not simulacrum or gate.
Wizard, cleric, and druid are the best summoners. You could make a specialized bard, but you would give up other spells to do it. Wizard has simulacrum and the ability to dominate creatures. He's probably the best class at doing the one man army thing, but maybe the druid is on par. The cleric is the best at utilizing what used to be called outsiders.
Oh yeah, absolutely. I would expect you to do this. Chicken-hassle has been a major part of the fun in games I've played with necromancers, even ones who don't even know Vampiric Touch yet but are planning to learn how to sacrifice chickens to the Dark Gods of Life Drain when they hit 5th level. Whether it's buying chickens, shepherding chickens away from wolves, or responding to a wererat attack by casually tossing a live chicken on the flames of a burning house (horrifying the other PCs who don't realize that it's an act of hunger and not pique), chickens have been awesome so far and I would expect that to apply in other games as well. But at least they are cheap, and they breed quickly, so it's only hassle and not a prohibitive expense like healing potions are.
I don't see a huge problem with it myself. You can only carry so many live chickens. They can give away your location for ambush. It's only once per turn and requires an action, so not real useful for combat. It's a unique way to regain hit points during downtime similar to the alarm spell with Arcane Ward. I don't see it as a unbalanced. It adds an amusing role-play element. Necromancers are always playing with dead things. It seems appropriate.
Shadowdweller00
Adventurer
I like the flavor of the idea, myself. Seems very voodoo. That said, have yet to see possible abuses in game....which might not materialize given that the ability is self only, requires concentration, and ALSO requires use of an action which might otherwise be spent actually defeating one's enemies.I don't see a huge problem with it myself. You can only carry so many live chickens. They can give away your location for ambush. It's only once per turn and requires an action, so not real useful for combat. It's a unique way to regain hit points during downtime similar to the alarm spell with Arcane Ward. I don't see it as a unbalanced. It adds an amusing role-play element. Necromancers are always playing with dead things. It seems appropriate.
I like the flavor of the idea, myself. Seems very voodoo. That said, have yet to see possible abuses in game....which might not materialize given that the ability is self only, requires concentration, and ALSO requires use of an action which might otherwise be spent actually defeating one's enemies.
Yep. Very much fits with the necromancer/voodoo priest.
FormerlyHemlock
Hero
Wizard, cleric, and druid are the best summoners. You could make a specialized bard, but you would give up other spells to do it. Wizard has simulacrum and the ability to dominate creatures. He's probably the best class at doing the one man army thing, but maybe the druid is on par. The cleric is the best at utilizing what used to be called outsiders.
The druid can do everything the wizard can when it comes to summoning, plus he can also transform all of his minions into birds via Animal Shapes and fly to the target, then turn them all into raging elephants for free HP. Or he can just throw down 32 wolves instead. Wizard gets a simulacrum but it appears to me that the druid is overall better at the one-man army thing.
Edit: well, druids and necromancers are probably on par with each other.
FormerlyHemlock
Hero
I don't see a huge problem with it myself. You can only carry so many live chickens. They can give away your location for ambush. It's only once per turn and requires an action, so not real useful for combat. It's a unique way to regain hit points during downtime similar to the alarm spell with Arcane Ward. I don't see it as a unbalanced. It adds an amusing role-play element. Necromancers are always playing with dead things. It seems appropriate.
I don't see it as unbalanced either. Mechanically it's only about as effective as a Lore Bard stealing Aura of Vitality. (Which one is more efficient depends mainly upon what the DM rules as the AC of a chicken, although of course in practice Aura of Healing will always be better because you can spread the healing to whoever is damaged.) Mostly it's fun because 1.) it's hilarious RP, 2.) it makes Grim Harvest something other than pointless, 3.) it's a relatively unique capability for wizards.
It's not overpowered though.
The druid can do everything the wizard can when it comes to summoning, plus he can also transform all of his minions into birds via Animal Shapes and fly to the target, then turn them all into raging elephants for free HP. Or he can just throw down 32 wolves instead. Wizard gets a simulacrum but it appears to me that the druid is overall better at the one-man army thing.
Edit: well, druids and necromancers are probably on par with each other.
Except use gate. That is a very high level ability.
32 wolves killed by one fireball or AoE attack. I like what the druid can do. Is 32 wolves better than 32 mephitis with temporary hit points if that route was followed? How many wolves could an army of mephitis kill? Access to gate is a huge deal too.
Now cleric versus wizard I might hesitate a little bit. Clerics have easier access to outsiders with damage resistance and other powerful abilities. The cleric does have access to gate and might with a amenable DM talk an outsider that serves her god into working for her without having to bind it. High level clerics are a little scary.
I feel like the summoning order is at high level is:
1. Cleric: Because fiends and celestials are powerful and no one can get more of them than the cleric.
2. Wizard: gate spell allows them to bind something nasty.
3. Druid:
Earlier say in the 7 to 12 range:
1. Druid: More types of conjuration spells.
2. Wizard: See above.
3. Cleric: Not much to summon. Almost non-existent.
It's kind of strange how the cleric goes from not having summons to powerful summoner as levels progress. It seems some classes work that way. Some are powerful very early on like the fighter or barbarian, Some are powerful much later on like the wizard, cleric, and monk.
Some stay pretty solid throughout their run like the bard, rogue, and paladin.
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