Westworld [spoilers]

Morrus

Well, that was fun
Staff member
Now the series has finished, what did you think of it? I got pretty confused for quite a lot of it. I think I understood it by the end, though I'm still not too clear on some motivations. Why did Ford have himself killed? Why was Maeve programmed to try to escape and then change her mind? What exactly was the MiB (William) looking for? That maze metaphor was described as being the route to consciousness for the hosts, but what was it to him, and why?

Interesting seeing the samurai. I assume there are other worlds. I never did see the sequel to the movie, Futureworld.
 

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MarkB

Legend
I found it highly entertaining throughout. Really great performances by just about everybody, and it did a good job of unfolding its mysteries and then answering (most of) them by the end. Some of the twists were predictable, but it also didn't try to hang onto them or treat them as unguessable revelations - it felt like it wanted the audience to puzzle them out.

Why did Ford have himself killed?

I think he felt that his part in his creations' story was complete, and that it was a fitting way to end it. He also accepted his role in the torments visited upon the Hosts, and that a penance was due.

Why was Maeve programmed to try to escape and then change her mind?

Exactly who programmed Maeve and why is one of the few mysteries that the series is taking into the next season. But I'd like to think that her last-minute change of mind, at least, was her own decision, not part of that design.

What exactly was the MiB (William) looking for? That maze metaphor was described as being the route to consciousness for the hosts, but what was it to him, and why?

I thought that was spelled out well enough. He was looking for some sign that it was more than a mere rigged game, that there was something deeper to find, and some form of genuine challenge. He was right, but for the wrong reasons - those answers were never his to seek.

Interesting seeing the samurai. I assume there are other worlds. I never did see the sequel to the movie, Futureworld.

Futureworld explores the other dark potential of being able to create completely realistic facsimiles of humans. It sees the proprietors of the Park attempting to gain clandestine influence by replacing key political figures with robotic duplicates. That's a subject that Westworld has so far touched upon and skirted around, particularly with the character Bernard, but it never faced it head-on. After Ford had Theresa killed, I was sure that the work-in-progress Host being built in his private facility would become her clone, but they swerved away from that angle.

I expect it's something the series will revisit later on - the concept has too much potential to be ignored entirely. It wouldn't surprise me if that was Delos's ultimate motivation for investing in the park - the reason why they considered it merely a side project, but were averse to any suggestion of dumbing-down the Hosts.
 

was

Adventurer
..IMO, in addition to what was said previously:

1.) Why did Ford have himself killed?

...It might have been a tribute to his friend's sacrifice and ideals. Killed by the same gal, with the same gun, in the same way.

...It also might have been penance for the people he had killed.

2.) Why did Maeve change her mind?

...I think Maeve tried, but was unable, to convince herself that her love for her lost child was just part of her programming. In the end, she just couldn't choose to leave her child behind.
 

MistyF

First Post
..IMO, in addition to what was said previously:

1.) Why did Ford have himself killed?

...It might have been a tribute to his friend's sacrifice and ideals. Killed by the same gal, with the same gun, in the same way.

...It also might have been penance for the people he had killed.

2.) Why did Maeve change her mind?

...I think Maeve tried, but was unable, to convince herself that her love for her lost child was just part of her programming. In the end, she just couldn't choose to leave her child behind.

I think you're right about about Maeve motivation and it was a big Ford plan, he defenetly know that she was programmed for escape and hope that she will receive the same humanity as Dolores, when she will care about her child, not about herself.

But Ford killed himself cos he wanted to give freedoom to all machines. After the war between humans and AIs. He told Dolores that she should start fighting for the freedom and shows to people that she is not a doll. Show this in the same way Arnold tried to stop the AI's expluatation.
 

1) I think there's more to Felix than we know (hes programming her but at same time someone else is writing her story). he barely looks scared
2) my guess is next year we see 1) a rescue mission, 2) shogun world 3) maeves daughter in another world
3) the 2 security guard investigators. My theory is 1 or both alive but if im right why did Ford spare them
4) the host that was captured with the cannibals and then wants teddy to be reprogrammed-there has to be more to this. Why do what they did to MIb (hanging)
5) the reaction of some of the hosts at the beach once bad things start happening. theres reals sadism in their eyes
6) the old vs the new models. Reminds me of the battlestar cylons. Has to be more to it than body type
7) the awakening based on the little girl holding the spaceman toy. That toy doesn't fit into much of what we have seen
8) why the 1 host smashed his head in
 

MarkB

Legend
3) the 2 security guard investigators. My theory is 1 or both alive but if im right why did Ford spare them

I think there may have been another force at work there - perhaps the same one who programmed Maeve.

7) the awakening based on the little girl holding the spaceman toy. That toy doesn't fit into much of what we have seen

The toy wasn't a spaceman, as I recall. It was a depiction of the masked and suited clean-up crew.
 

Now the series has finished, what did you think of it? I got pretty confused for quite a lot of it. I think I understood it by the end, though I'm still not too clear on some motivations.

I think I understood it for the most part. But the ending definitely left a lot of questions.

Why did Ford have himself killed?

This is my main question as well. Throughout the show it seems clear that Ford feels his friend was foolish to get himself killed by his own creation. So this is completely at odds with the final episode. Furthermore, we are shown that the hosts cannot actually kill Ford. There's a hidden piece of code that stopped Bernard from killing him for example. It would seem strange to me that the other older hosts would not have had this same update. Besides, Ford makes a big show out of it in front of his guests too.

Did Ford perhaps fake his own death, by having them kill a host copy of himself? Maybe the Man in Black was right? Maybe what the park needs is real stakes, and so Ford provides? This would also explain the Man in Black's reaction at the end. He finally got what he wished for. And he and all the other guests are the first players for this new narrative. I think from now on, the hosts will remember, and they will be able to kill guests.

Why was Maeve programmed to try to escape and then change her mind?

I can only speculate. Maybe she decided on her own to stay in her world? That would mean she truly has free will. Or maybe her quest for freedom was all an elaborate experiment by Ford to see how far he could push the ai?

What exactly was the MiB (William) looking for? That maze metaphor was described as being the route to consciousness for the hosts, but what was it to him, and why?

This seems clear to me. The Man in Black was looking for real danger. Not fake threats where the hosts cannot kill the guests. He believed Arnold had found the secret to liberating the hosts. Throughout the show you can see his disappointment whenever he is not under any actual threat. The Man in Black has played in the game for so long, that the illusion has shattered, and he sees beyond the fakery. He wants something that is real, and he believes the maze is the key to finding that.

Interesting seeing the samurai. I assume there are other worlds. I never did see the sequel to the movie, Futureworld.

I believe they mention in the show that there was also a sort of horror narrative, and the Man in Black mentions that he owns a stake in this world, as well as others. This means there are many more of these worlds. In the movie I believe there is also a medieval, future and a roman world.

What really interests me is the actual scale of it all. It seems that West World itself is about the size of a small country, but it ends at an ocean. So what lies beyond the ocean? More parks? Cities? Or did they claim themselves an entire planet to build their parks on? We know remarkably little about the actual world of West World beyond the park. We know that it takes place in the future, but are we still on earth?
 
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Morrus

Well, that was fun
Staff member
Seems to me that if you want the hosts to be able to kill you, the goal would be to have the no-kill setting switched off in the software, not to search for the centre of a metaphorical maze.
 

Seems to me that if you want the hosts to be able to kill you, the goal would be to have the no-kill setting switched off in the software, not to search for the centre of a metaphorical maze.

I think it is less simple than that. The Man in Black seems to be looking for something that is real, and not just deadly. Real stakes, characters that can step out of their predefined routines, and a world that can change. Not all that different from what a lot of players are looking for in an MMO. But difficult to accomplish with ai, I would presume.

The Man in Black seems annoyed that nothing ever changes, and that the hosts never seem to remember anything. He can do the most awful things to a host, and a few days later, it is as if nothing ever happened. And there are never any real consequences either. If there were, it would be a lot more exciting, and dangerous.
 

Morrus

Well, that was fun
Staff member
I think it is less simple than that. The Man in Black seems to be looking for something that is real, and not just deadly. Real stakes, characters that can step out of their predefined routines, and a world that can change. Not all that different from what a lot of players are looking for in an MMO. But difficult to accomplish with ai, I would presume.

The Man in Black seems annoyed that nothing ever changes, and that the hosts never seem to remember anything. He can do the most awful things to a host, and a few days later, it is as if nothing ever happened. And there are never any real consequences either. If there were, it would be a lot more exciting, and dangerous.

I understand that. I just feel it's vague and weak.
 

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