D&D 5E Why I Am Starting to Prefer 4d6 Drop the Lowest Over the Default Array.

Oofta

Legend
That's part of the "push." I just wonder why they chose to push HP toward stability and stats toward randomness.

That's assuming that they did. It does seem that they decided that extremely high ability scores were not necessary to the game. In previous editions I knew a lot of people who tanked everything but an ability or two in order to max out their primary ability score and limiting to 15 stops that.

However, if you limit the random rolls to "moderate" 8-15 level values point buy is slightly better than random. Comparing outside of that range will, of course give you different results based on assumptions.

But I don't presume to know what the designers were thinking.
 

log in or register to remove this ad

Lanefan

Victoria Rules
That's part of the "push." I just wonder why they chose to push HP toward stability and stats toward randomness.
Just a guess, but might it be because they think the CR model works better when there's a vague idea of how much abuse the party can take, while not relying so much on what the party can dish out?
 

Wulffolk

Explorer
I prefer limited randomness for both stats and HP.

Roll 3d6, replace one die with a 4. Generates abilities between 6-16. I encourage the player to keep stats in the order rolled, but do not prohibit them from rearranging to suit their concept.

Maxed HP at 1st level, then 1d4 +2/4/6/8, depending on HD size. (EX: 1d4+2 for Wizards or 1d4+8 for Barbarians)

I also give the character a choice of a bonus language, tool or skill for each point of Intelligence bonus, and reduce the number of skills or tools for each negative modifier to Intelligence.
 
Last edited:

MoonSong

Rules-lawyering drama queen but not a munchkin
Yeah, but that's a roleplaying choice, not a mechanical consequence of low stats. My anecdotal observation is that people who disliked rolled stats are generally unwilling to roleplay low Int anyway, so they'd probably just play JoeBob with his full tactical capabilities, which are considerable. (In fact, JoeBob is one of the few PCs you'll ever get to play who actually gets SMARTER when he Polymorphs into a Giant Ape and starts chucking rocks!)

But then again, they wouldn't be playing JoeBob in the first place at my table--they'd have just taken the standard array or point buy.

Anyway, I don't like roleplaying low Int generally, so I thought up JoeBob's senility/trigger-response pattern as my way of making him fun to play. I would enjoy playing JoeBob and mumbling cryptic things and stumbling around. I wouldn't enjoy doing so every session for years at a time, but there isn't any PC I'd enjoy playing every session for years at a time--variety is the spice of life, and that's what character trees are for.


You don't have to take my word for it, but I'd prefer some form of pointbuy that allowed me to have truly low stats, and roleplaying truly low int is something I'm really, really looking forward to. I've even thought of limiting this potential character to just 500 or so words and avoid difficult words and complex sentences.
 


sydbar

Explorer
I have played 7 5E characters since it came out and 6 were made with 4d6-lowest and 5 of those characters have rolled 6 and my halfling diviner had rolled a highest stat of 14.
 

Satyrn

First Post


You don't have to take my word for it, but I'd prefer some form of pointbuy that allowed me to have truly low stats, and roleplaying truly low int is something I'm really, really looking forward to. I've even thought of limiting this potential character to just 500 or so words and avoid difficult words and complex sentences.

My favorite moment with my 6 Int half orc cleric was when I went to open a dungeon's main door with the key I had. When the DM told me there was no keyhole, I decided my dumb cleric got frustrated and threw the key at the door - which is all that was needed to open it!

I found the solution quicker - immediately - because of my low Int. :cool:
 

diaglo

Adventurer
When 5E came out we used the default array for the PCs. After a year or so we started using 4d6 drop the lowest. It tends to result in higher scores than the default array. Put simply I think 5E function better and it opens up more options with higher ability scores.

Put simply it seems to fix certain classes if you roll high and it makes things like TWF more viable and it also makes medium armor suck less. It also makes things like the hypothetical Mountain Dwarf wizard or Sorcerer more viable.

All of the gish classes also look a lot better if you roll higher ability scores. If you roll crap the Moon Druid is a great class along with the Morph from EN5ider. A main problem of all the gish classes in the PHB with the exception of the Paladin is multiple ability dependency (MAD). Put simply to be effective you need a good physical score, spellcasting stat, decent con, and dex as well if you are using medium armor. Put simply you kind of want 4 stats 14 or higher or a 14 dex with medium armor or 15 strength in heavy armor. Valor Bards are a prime example as they want a decent attack stat, charisma, dex and con. Most of the gish also are not proficient in con saves.

The dex based melee classes and TWF also tend to get over shadowed due to certain feats (unless you are having a featless game then dex is super stat). This is because you want to get a 20 dex ASAP so you can get your 17 or 19 AC (AC 18-20 strength based generally). With point buy you can get 20 dex by level 6 or 8. A 20 strength is nice for a strength based fighter but 18 strength+ feat is a great option as your AC is not keyed to your strength score.

Other options that tend to be a bit meh are things like Bladedancers in SCAG. Under point buy they are not actually that good at erm blade dancing and you are better off usgin it to enhance your AC, movement and concentration rolls than attempt to be a bad fighter. Our Bladedancer rolls 3 scores over 16 and with racial modifiers + resilient(con) feat she has 3 18's at level 4 (con, int, dex). She plays a very aggressive wizard suffice to say in regards to melee and uses flaming sphere+ melee attacks (1d8+4+2d6+2d6 damage lvl 4).

So basically my players are mnoving away from the usual feats as they tend to have higher ability scores and prefer being awesome with new options (monks, gish, etc) over abusing the usual suspects (GWM, SS, CE, PAM) which they did earlier in 5E's run. We have Rogues defaulting to daggers as a weapon, sword and board fighters using short swords, assassins dual wielding.

3d6 in order.
Str
Int
Wis
Con
Dex
Cha

d6 hps

0hp is dead
 


Saeviomagy

Adventurer
3d6 in order.
Str
Int
Wis
Con
Dex
Cha

d6 hps

0hp is dead

Which works great! IF all of character creation is just as fast as this bit. But in 5e, that's not the case.

So what can we do to make it the case?

1. Your class is selected for you, somehow. OD&D had attribute minimums to limit your class choices down to only a few possibilities. I think the multiclass requirements probably suffice for this one. If you don't actually meet any requirements, treat your highest stat as if it is 13 and look again (or alternately set your highest stat to 13 and try again...).

2. Your race needs similar limitations. I reckon we do away with the stat bonuses and just give each race stat minimums for their best stats (of 10+ their current bonus, so a high elf has to have a 12+ dex and an 11+ int) while human has no minimums. Same overall effect (ie - dragonborn are strong and charismatic, elves are dextrous), less analysis paralysis.

3. Spells and cantrips need to be pre-selected as well. Probably break all the cantrip lists into offense and utility and then let you pick a list for each cantrip you know and roll it. And probably hand out thaumaturgy/prestidigitation/druidcraft/eldritch blast by default to the appropriate classes. I guess for spells you would split them into offense/defense/utility. Bards, sorcerors and warlocks kind of get shafted to start, but they can improve things as they level.

4. Skills and backgrounds. Cut the known skills for each class down to 2. Cut the list of traits/flaws/bonds for backgrounds way back (maybe just group them by alignment into sets). Roll random background.
 

Remove ads

Top