Lantan and smokepowder

KahlessNestor · Jul 18, 2017

So I had an idea and wondering if I can make it AL legal. I was thinking of working up a kind of "gunslinger", maybe from Lantan, maybe just a worshiper of Gond. Use a fighter chassis and just refluff crossbows. Hand crossbows = pistols. Light and heavy crossbows = rifles. Crossbow bolts = shot. Grab the crossbow expert feat. There is/was smokepowder in FR. I just haven't seen any mention of the status of Lantan since 5E.

Eltab · Jul 18, 2017

If you run Out of the Abyss as an AL-legal campaign, one of the Underdark Cities has a special Light Crossbow variant that may help you.

Eltab · Jul 18, 2017

KahlessNestor said:
I just haven't seen any mention of the status of Lantan since 5E.

And you probably won't. (Alas.)
Grand History of the Realms has a page (written in Elminster's voice) that discusses the problem of introducing gunpowder into D&D campaigns.
It's just so much better than muscle power, EVERYBODY wants in on the game...

Pauper · Jul 18, 2017

Eltab said:
If you run Out of the Abyss as an AL-legal campaign, one of the Underdark Cities has a special Light Crossbow variant that may help you.

Be aware, however, that the DDAL FAQ notes that characters can never become proficient with this weapon. (p.10)

Because of this, it's not enough to simply equate crossbows and firearms; there must actually be firearms listed on the weapon charts in a DDAL-legal rules source in order for a character to become proficient in their use.

Of course, you can do whatever you want in a home game, but in DDAL, there is no legal way (as of the time of this writing) to make this work.

--
Pauper

KahlessNestor · Jul 19, 2017

Eltab said:
And you probably won't. (Alas.)
Grand History of the Realms has a page (written in Elminster's voice) that discusses the problem of introducing gunpowder into D&D campaigns.
It's just so much better than muscle power, EVERYBODY wants in on the game...

I'm not intending on carrying around a bunch of gunpowder to do anything with. I know that would be illegal.

I did find one mention of Lantan in SCAG mentioning it was back, and more isolationist than before. But that was it.

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KahlessNestor · Jul 19, 2017

Pauper said:
Be aware, however, that the DDAL FAQ notes that characters can never become proficient with this weapon. (p.10)

Because of this, it's not enough to simply equate crossbows and firearms; there must actually be firearms listed on the weapon charts in a DDAL-legal rules source in order for a character to become proficient in their use.

Of course, you can do whatever you want in a home game, but in DDAL, there is no legal way (as of the time of this writing) to make this work.

--
Pauper

This isn't the consensus I am getting from the AL Facebook and Google+ communities. All I am doing is refluffing (changing the names, or trappings, if you're a Savage Worlds fan). No mechanical changes whatsoever. This is perfectly AL legal. Nothing in that FAQ even addresses what I am doing. It merely relates to one specific item (the musket), which I do not have.

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Pauper · Jul 19, 2017

KahlessNestor said:
This isn't the consensus I am getting from the AL Facebook and Google+ communities. All I am doing is refluffing (changing the names, or trappings, if you're a Savage Worlds fan). No mechanical changes whatsoever. This is perfectly AL legal.

Reflavoring (or for you Champions fans, altering the special effects) is AL-legal, yes.** However, even a reflavored abliity is subject to DM approval at any specific AL table, so you can't just assume any AL DM will accept your reflavoring (though, as you note, a number will).

This will be especially true at a table where another PC has the musket and has been told (correctly) that the character cannot use proficiency and can never become proficient with the weapon. If you show up claiming that your heavy crossbow is actually a rifle and that since you are just 'reflavoring' the crossbow that you can use your proficiency with it, this could cause an issue at the table that the DM will need to deal with. The DM might well decide that disallowing your reflavoring is the proper solution.

For that reason, I wouldn't do it, as it muddies the water on an existing ruling without providing any real benefit.

** - Thanks for not starting up the 'axe-lute wars' again. : )

--
Pauper

KahlessNestor · Jul 20, 2017

I haven't met anyone with the musket. If another player is parsing the numbers on my character sheet, he should probably pay attention to his own. Lol But I would just tell him to go ahead and reflavor crossbows himself if he wants proficiency. Forget about the musket. Seems an underwhelming item. Trade for something better at Fai Chen's. Unless you like the RP aspect. Then keep it and don't complain about the lack of proficiency.

That said, if it is an issue, I don't have a problem being a "crossbow slinger" for one session so someone doesn't get their feathers ruffled. No one at my FLGS will care. I have only had one other person across the three social media platforms say they would have a problem, and none of them had actual rules support to back them

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Anthraxus · Jul 20, 2017

KahlessNestor said:
That said, if it is an issue, I don't have a problem being a "crossbow slinger" for one session so someone doesn't get their feathers ruffled. No one at my FLGS will care. I have only had one other person across the three social media platforms say they would have a problem, and none of them had actual rules support to back them

Conversely, is there something in the D&D rules that says you can have a crossbow/bolt combo and reflavor it as musket/bullets?

I'm fine with, say, renaming a Shortsword into Wakizashi, or a Longbow into a Yumi- but not fine with turning "wands into laser pistols" for a warlock, or crossbows into guns.

KahlessNestor · Jul 21, 2017

It's AL rules. Refluffing is okay, changing mechanics isn't.

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