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  1. #11
    Yeah I guess the whole reason I was looking at AT in the first place was the extra flexibility compared to the other rogue archetypes. So even though it made me more MAD I thought the utility might be worth it overall.

    So looking at the spell list I was considering I was trying to think what spells would I use a lot.

    Control Flame seems like it could have great synergy with Gloom Stalker by snuffing out torches/fires to create darkness.
    Mage Hand for general utility.
    Minor Illusion, again just generally useful.

    Hunter's Mark, this is from rangers so don't need AT.
    Find Familiar, help get advantage for sneaks.

    Hypnotic Pattern from stealth.
    Haste, for some dmg boosting.

    The rest of the spells would have been some utility, survivability, and CC. But realistically I'd probably not use other spells too much, and Haste/Hypnotic pattern would be super late game gets. So maybe the Magic Initiate feat is the way to go to get two of those cantrips and find familiar. Obviously going this route would mean the mage hand isn't as good as the AT's mage hand, but I could go with assassin or scout.

    Really the idea with this build is to abuse the Gloom Stalker abilities and I thought rogue seemed like the best combo both from a theme point of view being the sneaky fighter and seemed to generally mesh well with gloom stalker.

  2. #12
    All of your mentioned spells sound great.

    Another point for the Ranger Levels would be against creatures that rely on blindsight/tremorsense/truesight there is the 4th level ranger spell from xanathars.

    Guardian of Nature

    • You gain 10 temporary hit points.
    • You make Constitution saving throws with advantage.
    • You make Dexterity- and Wisdom-based attack rolls with advantage.
    • While you are on the ground, the ground within 15 feet of you is difficult terrain for your enemies.

    So when you are vsing enemies who can deal with your invisibility you still have a way to gain advantage


    You also need to keep in mind the restrinctions on rogue spells

    You know three 1st-level wizard spells of your choice, two of which you must choose from the enchantment and illusion spells on the wizard spell list.

    The Spells Known column of the Arcane Trickster Spellcasting table shows when you learn more wizard spells of 1st level or higher. Each of these spells must be an enchantment or illusion spell of your choice, and must be of a level for which you have spell slots. For instance, when you reach 7th level in this class, you can learn one new spell of 1st or 2nd level.

    The spells you learn at 8th, 14th, and 20th level can come from any school of magic.

    WIth 7 levels in rogue I would pick
    Find Familiar, Mirror Image, Invisibility, Blur there are several good spells , Hideous Laughter, Suggestion, Phantasmal Force, Crown of madness but they all require saves.
    XP wonderboy1227 gave XP for this post

  3. #13
    So I'm thinking it comes down to either of these builds:

    13 Trickster / 7 Gloom Stalker
    Pros:
    Higher sneak attack damage
    Can force disadvantage on the few spell dc spells I'll have
    1 extra feat / ASI
    Reliable Talent

    or

    13 Gloom Stalker / 7 Trickster
    Pros:
    Stalkers Furry
    Greater Invisibility
    Better ranger spellcasting, Guardian of Nature, Conjure Woodland Beings, Conjure Barrage

    In either case what do you think the build path would look like?

    I'm thinking 1 Rogue -> 5 Ranger -> 4 Rogue. That would get me Extra Attack, Elven Accuracy, and Sharpshooter by 9. I do think this path gives the fastest way to the core of the build. Which is use Gloom Stalker abilities in combination with Elven Accuracy and Sharpshooter to have big initial turns and then use Trickster spells / stealth to keep my sneak attacks consistent.

    Or In the 13 Gloom / 7 Trickster build, might be best to go 1 Rogue -> 13 Gloom. I'd get to greater invisibility fastest this way, but I'd get the utility of trickster cantrips/familiar a lot later.

    Another idea would be for skip Trickster. Go Rogue 1 -> 13 Gloom to start. Then go Scout but pickup magic initiate. The only issue I see with that is I wouldn't feel good about taking magic initiate until really late. Elven Accuracy, Sharpshooter, and +2 Dex seem like the first three feats/ASI to take.

    As a side note, its funny to see where the idea for this build started and where it is now. I did a one off where we started at 8 and ended at 10. I made a Tabaxi that started 5 Gloom Stalker / 3 Swashbuckler and used a rapier. By 10 he was 5/5. We ended up in a cave setting and using the darkness and tabaxi extra speed he was a force. So I wanted to create a similar build for Waterdeep. After looking at a bunch of rogue guides and writeups I had settled on 3 options. Ranged Rogue using sharpshooter to get high damage. Dual Wielding and going swashbuckler. And making a duelist build that would utilize booming blade. I ended up ruling out the Duelist build because I wanted this guy to use gloom stalker and the extra attack from dread ambusher doesn't mesh well with booming. So I'll probably build a Tabaxi Swashbuckler / Battlemaster down the road.
    Last edited by wonderboy1227; Monday, 10th September, 2018 at 04:20 PM.

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