Pathfinder 2E Pathfinder 2E or Pathfinder 1E?

Erekose · Feb 8, 2019

I'm sure this must have been talked about before but I can't find a relevant thread . . . it just occurs to me that given that Pathfinder became a haven for people that didn't want to move from 3.xE D&D to 4E, what will happen if "most" buyers of Pathfinder products stay with 1E rather than moving to 2E?

This isn't really a question about the relative merits of 1E and 2E so much as a query about where the bulk of Paizo's revenue comes from for Pathfinder. If it's the adventure paths rather than the rulebooks, then wouldn't low sales of 2E mean they might continue with 1E adventure paths?

That said, it's seems likely that the new adventure paths will be designed such that you can play them easily with either edition . . . so maybe it's a moot point?

Gladius Legis · Feb 8, 2019

Paizo better come up with some plan in that likely event. Reactions to the PF2e playtest were overwhelmingly and almost universally negative.

Jacob Lewis · Feb 8, 2019

Pathfinder has held its own by its own merits, not just as an alternative for D&D fans who can't get what they want out of current editions. 1e has been around for about 10 years now, and supported by a continous stream of new options and splatbooks that rivals any edition or era or D&D to date. Whether that is good or bad is a matter of opinion. But after ten years, I think Paizo believes they have taken the system as far as it can; farther than anyone else could, one could argue. New base classes, core rules expanding every major theme, and so much more.

Somewhere deep in their forums and announcements (and don't think I am going to locate every relevant link for anybody), it has been stated that the new edition has been in the works for years as a natural evolution, not a response to percieved success or failure anywhere. It is simply the right time.

Fact is, there is plenty of 1e material to fill a lifetime or two of adventure gaming. And they have stated they will continue to print these older products as long as there is demand for it. And there will likely be conversion guides either way, along with fan conversions.

Right now may not be the best time to discuss it, however. The open playtest saw a lot of changes in response to string feedback, and I suspect the final product may be much different than what we have seen. We don`t know what we will end up with or how fans will respond. But I do know this: Paizo has proven themselves repeatedly, and rarely disappoints. And there are still plenty of fans who are ready for something other than D&D 5e or PF 1e. Maybe they will hit the sweet spot in between. That remains to be seen. Here's hoping!

Retreater · Feb 8, 2019

I can speak only to my feelings about PF2 and anecdotes. I'm not a current PF player and haven't been since 5e was released. I've tried the playtest both at conventions and in a home game. I'll probably pick up the core rules because I'm a RPG collector and might give it a few sessions to test drive it. However even the PF fans I know don't plan to use it regularly (if at all). I think it runs a significant risk of dividing their player base.
I would be surprised if the 3pp market didn't address the wants of the PF1 fans. But I'd be equally surprised if Paizo continues to make PF1 material. I would expect them to make system agnostic material and rely on fan conversions of their APs.

Morrus · Feb 8, 2019

Erekose said:
it just occurs to me that given that Pathfinder became a haven for people that didn't want to move from 3.xE D&D to 4E,

It may have started like that 10 years ago, but there are tons of people who play PF these days who have never played D&D 3.x.

Erekose · Feb 8, 2019

Morrus said:
It may have started like that 10 years ago, but there are tons of people who play PF these days who have never played D&D 3.x.

Good point! But what if PF2E has the same impact on PF1E players that D&D4E had on D&D3.xE players?

Morrus · Feb 8, 2019

Erekose said:
Good point! But what if PF2E has the same impact on PF1E players that D&D4E had on D&D3.xE players?

Dunno. But PF1 came out of a perfect storm of a lot of things. It would be hard to replicate that success.

Ralif Redhammer · Feb 8, 2019

For me, I never really had a big attachment to 3e (having left it at the time for Castles & Crusades). I started playing Pathfinder at cons because I liked the worldbuilding and they had some really cool adventures to play. But after 2e was announced and preview material started to come out, it became clear that it was going to be even more fiddly than 1e (which was already pushing my tolerance for fiddly bits).

After that, I just stopped playing it at cons. I still play a little Starfinder, though, and am likely to stick with that instead of either migrating to 2e or sticking to 1e.

Don’t get me wrong, Pathfinder 1e has more content than just about any other RPG at this point. It’s creaky and bloated, so they had to do something. But for a system based on staying true to an older rules set, a second edition is a tough needle to thread.

zztong · Feb 12, 2019

Erekose said:
I'm sure this must have been talked about before but I can't find a relevant thread . . . it just occurs to me that given that Pathfinder became a haven for people that didn't want to move from 3.xE D&D to 4E, I'm sure this must have been talked about before but I can't find a relevant thread . . . it just occurs to me that given that Pathfinder became a haven for people that didn't want to move from 3.xE D&D to 4E, what will happen if "most" buyers of Pathfinder products stay with 1E rather than moving to 2E?

This isn't really a question about the relative merits of 1E and 2E so much as
That said, it's seems likely that the new adventure paths will be designed such that you can play them easily with either edition . . . so maybe it's a moot point?a query about where the bulk of Paizo's revenue comes from for Pathfinder. If it's the adventure paths rather than the rulebooks, then wouldn't low sales of 2E mean they might continue with 1E adventure paths?

That said, it's seems likely that the new adventure paths will be designed such that you can play them easily with either edition . . . so maybe it's a moot point?

What happens to Paizo depends on sales. If the 1e folks don't largely follow Paizo to 2e then Paizo needs new players. If revenues are lower then Paizo will need to examine its options. IIRC, they are not planning to support 1e with their APs.

I toyed around with Google Trends thinking it might describe interest in both D&D and Pathfinder. Its not sales data, of course. I'm not saying interest correlates with sales. I just don't know. The spike in interest in Pathfinder near the end of the graph corresponds with the announcement of the playtest. If you extend the range of time you can see the 4e effect.

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today 5-y&geo=US&q=/m/026q9,/m/04dzk1_