Unsatisfied with the D&D 5e skill system

DND_Reborn · May 4, 2019

robus said:
And yet there seems to be lots of confusion for some people. Certainly WotC doesn’t encourage that interpretation in their adventures when practically every suggested ability check is qualified with a skill...

The biggest problem WotC has is that while there’s plenty of good and useful information in the core books it is generally presented in such a way as to make that information confusing at best or buried under a bunch of unrelated stuff at worst.

I guess I've just never seen any confusion about it, and it surprises me when others seem to say theres "lots of confusion" about it. Although the skill list is hardly exhaustive, most tasks do have a skill that is applicable IMO (forcing open a door or something similar being the most common offender). I think the most useful thing to learn from his article is to be flexible about ability scores and skills, choosing the best combination applicable to the task.

But, I certainly agree that the presentation of the information if very faulty in many parts.

Stalker0 · May 4, 2019

dnd4vr said:
Actually, after reading his article, I didn't feel like there was much there not already covered in the PHB. Ability scores are "key", skills are added if they apply to the task.

Of course the AngryDM cannot be wrong, but I do think he underestimates the tenacity of players. So if everytime a player jumps a pit I say "make a strength check" they will inevitably follow up with "can I use my athletics?"

After the 5th time its just easier to say "make an athletics check"....and that is when the slippery slope of ability checks -> skills begins.

Satyrn · May 4, 2019

robus said:
I pushed back on Satyrn a bit at that idea, but you’re both probably right. If there’s trust then it should be fine, and, of course, if there’s not trust then there are going to much bigger issues than a skill proficiency battle

Aye. And even at my table, ultimately there's still the opportunity to veto the decision.

I find that letting the decision be theirs - but one that I can veto - means when the grey areas pop up, the decision is far more likely to lean toward the player's perspective than if I'm actively deciding yes/no everytime. And hopefully this means the player is confident that things are gonna go the way they imagine when they're describing their action, and that confidence let's them focus on the action itself rather than trying to focus on making sure I choose the skill they're aiming for.

Nebulous · May 5, 2019

I have to agree. While some group do use it easily enough, I have found plenty of confusion, as have my players.

Nebulous · May 5, 2019

dnd4vr said:
I guess I've just never seen any confusion about it, and it surprises me when others seem to say theres "lots of confusion" about it. Although the skill list is hardly exhaustive, most tasks do have a skill that is applicable IMO (forcing open a door or something similar being the most common offender). I think the most useful thing to learn from his article is to be flexible about ability scores and skills, choosing the best combination applicable to the task.

But, I certainly agree that the presentation of the information if very faulty in many parts.

Yes, I think a lot of it is presentation, maybe being a little too open ended with DM fiat, and lacking enough concrete examples in the book.

robus · May 5, 2019

Nebulous said:
Yes, I think a lot of it is presentation, maybe being a little too open ended with DM fiat, and lacking enough concrete examples in the book.

When I read Iserith’s guide to adjudicating actions (if you haven’t you should) it was a revelation and i remember exclaiming at the time that it should be in the DMG’s section on running the game.

Greenstone.Walker · May 6, 2019

Stalker0 said:
After the 5th time its just easier to say "make an athletics check"....and that is when the slippery slope of ability checks -> skills begins.

Well, stop saying "athletics check".

Seriously, though, if you consistently use the phrase "Strength (Athletics) check", it will help everyone at the table remember what is going on.

Nebulous · May 6, 2019

robus said:
When I read Iserith’s guide to adjudicating actions (if you haven’t you should) it was a revelation and i remember exclaiming at the time that it should be in the DMG’s section on running the game.

Oh, where would I find that?

Swarmkeeper · May 6, 2019

Nebulous said:
Oh, where would I find that?

Here

Saeviomagy · May 17, 2019

Sabathius42 said:
If you, Saeviomagy, were somehow teleported into your D&D game (Tron style) and directly onto the side of a cliff you were in the middle of free climbing and had to choose a body for the ascent would you choose....

Because you have pre-supposed that I'm forced to be climbing, obviously the one with a lesser chance of failure... however the reality is that if free climbing was as dangerous as 5th ed makes it, neither they nor I would have chosen to commence the climb in the first place.