Tony Vargas
Legend
Since this temporary forum is pointedly not under 5e discussion, clearly it's not limited to the discussion of adding the Warlord to 5e. Anyone have versions of the Warlord for pre-4e? We know there's a PF Warlord, and the poor Marshal from the Miniature Handbook, but what if, in some quantum alternate universe, there were earlier versions of the class?
To kick it off, here's an old thread from the soon-to-be-defunct WotC boards, where I dashed off a 2e Warlord (and, wow, are 2e classes easy to just dash off). It hasn't been edited for typos (check out all the the thier for their, I so sucked at that) or obvious rules issues or non-conformance to dogma (I said 'heal', I was so naive!), and it was 6 years ago, so if you're wondering what I meant by a particular phrasing, I probably don't know...
If anyone else wants to do a 2e take - maybe riffing of C&T, which I never got around to - please, don't let the couple hours I put into it stop you.
Don't even let the Marshal stop you from doing a 3.0 or 3.5 version, either, if you feel like it.
1e, 0D&D, B/X, RC, Arduin Grimoire, fantasy heart-breaker of choice, whatever - knock yourselves out.
[sblock="thread start"]
Nov 30, 2009 16:43:44
aether99
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Ive been playing DnD for a while. However not the likes that you are probably used to. My friends do it with a rule set somewhere between 1 and 2...with some home rules.
Its my only experience with DnD (aside from a few videogames like NWN) so I cant really compare it.
However the player handbook for the 4th edition was on sale when I was buying some dice and decided to get it out of curiousity. Some of it is interesting enough, but what mainly interested me is the new races/classes. Well...not new, but new for me! Mainly dragonborn and the warlord class.
Id like to figure out some way to manipulate those two into working for the homebrewed ruleset that my friends and I play. In the very least the Dragonborn which shouldnt be a problem. But I like the idea of the warlord class alot.
Its a vague and odd question I know
Dec 01, 2009 14:56:43
Tony_Vargas
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>> Ive been playing DnD for a while. However not the likes that you are probably used to. My friends do it with a rule set somewhere between 1 and 2...with some home rules.
I've known lots of people to do that. Well, if by 'some' house rules you mean D-ring binders full of 'em. Once you've put a lot of work into your own campaign world and rules variants, it's not always worth it to adopt each new edition of the game you originally based 'em on.
>> Id like to figure out some way to manipulate those two into working for the homebrewed ruleset that my friends and I play. In the very least the Dragonborn which shouldnt be a problem. But I like the idea of the warlord class alot.
Obviously it'd be hard to do without knowing your house rules, but I don't see any reason you couldn't adapt the Warlord to 1e/2e. It depends on whether you want more of the warlord concept or more of its role. With the former, the Fighter is already pretty close, attracting a body of followers at higher level and all, a Kit would probably be enough to give a few tactics- or leadership-based benefits and give you a Warlord-themed Fighter. If the latter, you'd be introducing a non-casting 'Cleric' to the game, which'd be trickier. You'd have to decide if you want to go with mechanics similar to the existing healers (Clerics & Druids - meaning relatively potent, daily abilities) or if you'd want to try to implement some healing ('inspiring') function with mechanics more consistent with those of non-casters (so unlimitted-use, but less powerful).[/sblock]
Dec 01, 2009 17:05:51
Tony_Vargas
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OK, here's a quick shot at a 2e Warlord.
The Warlord is a member of the Warrior group and gains levels/HD based on the Paladin/Ranger column of Table 14, attacks per round as per table 15, and proficiencies per table 34.
Warlord
Ability Requirements: Strength 13, Constitution 10, Intelligence 9, Charisma 14
Prime Requisites: Strength, Charisma (The Warlord gains a +10% bonus to earned experience if his prime requisites are all 16+).
While Warlords do not need Dexterity per se, it is desireable to avoid damage on the battlefield, or if the Warlord wishes to use a bow or other missle weapon more effectively.
Warlords can be of any alignment, but tend more towards law and towards neutrality with respect to good and evil, since leading men in battle demands discipline and a certain calousness or dispassion with respect to sentient life. Even so, chaotic warlords can be found leading loosely-organized bands of warriors through sheer charisma, and heroic ones fight unavoidable wars for the greater good.
While not quite the master of arms that the Fighter is, the Warlord considers himself to wield more than the weapons he grips in his hands. To the Warlord, soldiers and other allies are as much weapons to be forged and wielded with skill as are swords and arrows, and the terrain of a battlefield or fortifications of a castle as much defenses as a good shield or strong armor. Anytime a Warlord is entitled to make an attack, he can command an ally to attack in his stead, granting that ally a damage bonus equal to his 'Loyalty Base' adjustement for Charisma (table 6). Each ally can only be so commanded once per round. If the Warlord is entitled to multiple attacks, he can use each to direct a different ally to attack, if he so desires or attack, himself, in addition to commanding an ally.
Warlords are followed by thier men not just because of their innate charisma or authority of rank or station, but because their tactical brilliance allows thier allies to perform better than they would acting on their own initiative. Whenever a warlord directs an ally in battle, and the ally carries out the action as ordered, the ally gains a +1 bonus to any attack or check involved - if the warlord's Intelligence score is 15 or higher, the bonus is increased to +2. This includes, but is not limitted to, the Warlord using one of his own attacks to command an ally to attack. The player of the Warlord cannot simply 'command' his allies to do whatever they were going to do anyway, though, the order must be meaningful - to change targets, use a specific spell, take advantage of an enemy weakness, or so forth. If the advice is particularly good, the action may well recieve a circumstantial bonus from the DM, as well.
Warlord's keep their men drilled and alert. When the Warlord rolls initiative for his party, he subtracts 2 from the roll, making it more likely his side will act first. When the Warlord's party rolls for surprise he deducts 1 from the die, so his party is less likely to be surprised. When a Warlord of at least 7th level leads a party into an Ambush he may make a saving throw vs Paralyzation to spoil the ambush, even if successful, though, his party must still roll for surprise.
Warlords attract a body of men at arms to serve with them, just as fighters do, but do not need to set up a stronghold to do so. Many Warlords choose to serve as a general for an established king or lord (such as high-level PC fighter) or lead ittinerant bands of mercinaries, instead.
Finally, Warlords are able to inspire thier men to great feats of courage and endurance. NPC allies of the warlord add his level to thier morale. Even more remarkably, the Warlord's inspiring leadership can rally men from the very brink of death.
Lead the Attack: With a valiant charge, the Warlord can inspire his allies to attack with increased ferocity. To use this ability, the Warlord must chose a specific enemy and charge that enemy before any other ally has attacked it. The Warlord's allies gain a +2 bonus to attack the same target until that target is killed, surrenders, or flees the combat. Each ally retains this bonus only so long as he attacks the designated target, if he turns his attention to a different enemy, he loses the bonus.
Inspiring Words: A Warlord of at least 3rd level can inspire a wounded comrade to renewed vigour and efforts. The warlord sacrifices one attack he is entitled to this round and instead Inspires an ally who can hear him. The chosen ally regains 1d8 hps per attack the Warlord foregoes that round. If the warlord is entitled to multiple attacks, he can use each to heal a different ally, or heal one ally and command him or another to attack (or attack himself). Each time an ally is healed with Inspiring Words, he must make a Saving Throw vs Death. If he fails the save, his wounds are too severe to be healed by Inspiring Words for the rest of the day. The ally does not have to make a this save if he has taken temporary damage from non-lethal combat or damage from non-physical sources, like Illusions, fear, or other forms of psychic trauma - such 'damage' can always be healed by Inspiring Words.
Rallying Call: Once per day, a Warlord of at least 5th level can rally his troops around him. The Warlord does not move or attack when using his Rallying Cry. Each ally who can hear him recovers hps as if the Warlord had used his available dice of healing from Inspiring Words that round to heal him, alone. If any affected ally is currently under a mind-affecting effect that a saving throw would have negated, he can also make a new saving throw. NPC allies who have been routed are immediately restored to good morale and return to the battle when they hear the Rallying Cry.
Faith in a Friend: Once per day, a Warlord of at least 9th level can inspire a close ally (fellow PC or henchman, not an ordinary hireling or temporary ally of convenience) to shake off the effects of a mortal wound or debilitating afliction long enough to return to the fight. The ally in question must be either at Death's Door, completely helpless, or have been (apparently) slain by an attack since the last time the Warlord acted, and the warlord must be able to see the ally, or the ally must be within the sound of his voice (though, obviously, he may not be conscious to hear it). The Warlord takes no other action for the round, and makes a saving throw vs Spells. If he succeeds, the effect or afliction that has rendered the ally helpless is removed; if he was (apparently) killed by a failed save, he is restored as if the save had been successful; if he was at death's door (or just 'apparently' killed by damage), he is restored to half his normal hps + 3d8 (though no more than his maximum hp total).
Fearsome Warcry: Once per day, a Warlord of at least 11th level can loose a terrible battle-cry that can break the morale of his enemies. Enemies with fewer than 4 levels/HD break and run automatically. Enemies subject to morale checks who hear the warlord must check morale immediately, with a penalty equal to the Warlord's Level + Reaction Adjustment (from Charisma, table 6). Enemies who succeed on thier morale check or who are not subject to morale failure still take a -2 penalty to attack the Warlord and his followers while the Warlord still stands. Any enemy with more than twice the Warlord's HDs/levels is unaffected.
Oooh... level titles:
1 Hussar
2 Seargant
3 Centurion
4 Hipparch
5 Tactician
6 Oberst
7 Brigadier
8 Strategist
9+ Warlord
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#12 Dec 05, 2009 17:12:28
Tony_Vargas
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Oh, I forgot race & level resrictions... unfortunately, they're in the 2e dmg, which I don't have handy, but I remember the 1e race/levels vaguely... so this is based on that, for 2e, up it a bit (or up it to match your house rules - many DMs did).
Race Warlord
-------- -------
Dwarf 9
Elf -
Gnome -
Helf-elf 5
Half-orc -
Halfling 8
Human U
*A Dwarf with STR of at least 17 can reach 10th level, one with STR 18 can reach 11th. A halfling with CHA at least 17 can reach 9th, one with CHA 18+ can reach 10th.
Seem about right?
[sblock="comments"]#9 Dec 03, 2009 12:56:57
dragonface
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Holy 2e flashback, Batman!
Initially I was thinking that a 2e warlord could be some sort of reflavored multi-class fighter/cleric with access to the combat, healing, guardian, and protection spheres (rules memory is a little vague, so forgive me if that isn't possible). But Tony_V's write-up looks pretty cool. Only thing I might change would be the Con 10 prereq to Wis 10, just because warlords seem more cerebral than the typical warrior.
I also like the dragonborn suggestions. (I think +1 Str/-1 Dex seems appropriate; they're big and bulky.)
I don't know how well this stuff would work in your game, Aether99, but it looks worth a try. Happy gaming!
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#10 Dec 03, 2009 21:22:23
undrave
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Don't forget the arbitrary limitations. Dragonborns shouldn't be allowed to be Magic-User or Thieves and should always be of Lawful alignement!
Oh and they don't like hobbits. A race needs someone to hate for no real reason XD
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#11 Dec 03, 2009 21:39:37
FitzNighteyes
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OK, here's a quick shot at a 2e Warlord.
*shiver*
That's incredible.
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Dec 07, 2009 15:38:31
bone_naga
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OK, here's a quick shot at a 2e Warlord.
Pure awesome. That brings back some nostalgic memories. If only such a class had existed back in the glory days of 2e, I would definitely have rolled on up.
Owner and Proprietor of the House of Trolls. God of ownership and possession.
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#14 Feb 24, 2013 19:34:15
Garthanos
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OK, here's a quick shot at a 2e Warlord.
*shiver*
That's incredible.
shivers.... I think me just broke out in hives.[/sblock]
Oh, and you're free to mock and deride the very idea, and to post lame parodies of the Warlord couched as past edition versions, too. This is not a serious thread! Just have fun with it, for whatever value of 'fun' works for you.
To kick it off, here's an old thread from the soon-to-be-defunct WotC boards, where I dashed off a 2e Warlord (and, wow, are 2e classes easy to just dash off). It hasn't been edited for typos (check out all the the thier for their, I so sucked at that) or obvious rules issues or non-conformance to dogma (I said 'heal', I was so naive!), and it was 6 years ago, so if you're wondering what I meant by a particular phrasing, I probably don't know...
If anyone else wants to do a 2e take - maybe riffing of C&T, which I never got around to - please, don't let the couple hours I put into it stop you.
Don't even let the Marshal stop you from doing a 3.0 or 3.5 version, either, if you feel like it.
1e, 0D&D, B/X, RC, Arduin Grimoire, fantasy heart-breaker of choice, whatever - knock yourselves out.
[sblock="thread start"]
Nov 30, 2009 16:43:44
aether99
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Ive been playing DnD for a while. However not the likes that you are probably used to. My friends do it with a rule set somewhere between 1 and 2...with some home rules.
Its my only experience with DnD (aside from a few videogames like NWN) so I cant really compare it.
However the player handbook for the 4th edition was on sale when I was buying some dice and decided to get it out of curiousity. Some of it is interesting enough, but what mainly interested me is the new races/classes. Well...not new, but new for me! Mainly dragonborn and the warlord class.
Id like to figure out some way to manipulate those two into working for the homebrewed ruleset that my friends and I play. In the very least the Dragonborn which shouldnt be a problem. But I like the idea of the warlord class alot.
Its a vague and odd question I know
Dec 01, 2009 14:56:43
Tony_Vargas
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>> Ive been playing DnD for a while. However not the likes that you are probably used to. My friends do it with a rule set somewhere between 1 and 2...with some home rules.
I've known lots of people to do that. Well, if by 'some' house rules you mean D-ring binders full of 'em.
Once you've put a lot of work into your own campaign world and rules variants, it's not always worth it to adopt each new edition of the game you originally based 'em on.>> Id like to figure out some way to manipulate those two into working for the homebrewed ruleset that my friends and I play. In the very least the Dragonborn which shouldnt be a problem. But I like the idea of the warlord class alot.
Obviously it'd be hard to do without knowing your house rules, but I don't see any reason you couldn't adapt the Warlord to 1e/2e. It depends on whether you want more of the warlord concept or more of its role. With the former, the Fighter is already pretty close, attracting a body of followers at higher level and all, a Kit would probably be enough to give a few tactics- or leadership-based benefits and give you a Warlord-themed Fighter. If the latter, you'd be introducing a non-casting 'Cleric' to the game, which'd be trickier. You'd have to decide if you want to go with mechanics similar to the existing healers (Clerics & Druids - meaning relatively potent, daily abilities) or if you'd want to try to implement some healing ('inspiring') function with mechanics more consistent with those of non-casters (so unlimitted-use, but less powerful).[/sblock]
Dec 01, 2009 17:05:51
Tony_Vargas
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OK, here's a quick shot at a 2e Warlord.
The Warlord is a member of the Warrior group and gains levels/HD based on the Paladin/Ranger column of Table 14, attacks per round as per table 15, and proficiencies per table 34.
Warlord
Ability Requirements: Strength 13, Constitution 10, Intelligence 9, Charisma 14
Prime Requisites: Strength, Charisma (The Warlord gains a +10% bonus to earned experience if his prime requisites are all 16+).
While Warlords do not need Dexterity per se, it is desireable to avoid damage on the battlefield, or if the Warlord wishes to use a bow or other missle weapon more effectively.
Warlords can be of any alignment, but tend more towards law and towards neutrality with respect to good and evil, since leading men in battle demands discipline and a certain calousness or dispassion with respect to sentient life. Even so, chaotic warlords can be found leading loosely-organized bands of warriors through sheer charisma, and heroic ones fight unavoidable wars for the greater good.
While not quite the master of arms that the Fighter is, the Warlord considers himself to wield more than the weapons he grips in his hands. To the Warlord, soldiers and other allies are as much weapons to be forged and wielded with skill as are swords and arrows, and the terrain of a battlefield or fortifications of a castle as much defenses as a good shield or strong armor. Anytime a Warlord is entitled to make an attack, he can command an ally to attack in his stead, granting that ally a damage bonus equal to his 'Loyalty Base' adjustement for Charisma (table 6). Each ally can only be so commanded once per round. If the Warlord is entitled to multiple attacks, he can use each to direct a different ally to attack, if he so desires or attack, himself, in addition to commanding an ally.
Warlords are followed by thier men not just because of their innate charisma or authority of rank or station, but because their tactical brilliance allows thier allies to perform better than they would acting on their own initiative. Whenever a warlord directs an ally in battle, and the ally carries out the action as ordered, the ally gains a +1 bonus to any attack or check involved - if the warlord's Intelligence score is 15 or higher, the bonus is increased to +2. This includes, but is not limitted to, the Warlord using one of his own attacks to command an ally to attack. The player of the Warlord cannot simply 'command' his allies to do whatever they were going to do anyway, though, the order must be meaningful - to change targets, use a specific spell, take advantage of an enemy weakness, or so forth. If the advice is particularly good, the action may well recieve a circumstantial bonus from the DM, as well.
Warlord's keep their men drilled and alert. When the Warlord rolls initiative for his party, he subtracts 2 from the roll, making it more likely his side will act first. When the Warlord's party rolls for surprise he deducts 1 from the die, so his party is less likely to be surprised. When a Warlord of at least 7th level leads a party into an Ambush he may make a saving throw vs Paralyzation to spoil the ambush, even if successful, though, his party must still roll for surprise.
Warlords attract a body of men at arms to serve with them, just as fighters do, but do not need to set up a stronghold to do so. Many Warlords choose to serve as a general for an established king or lord (such as high-level PC fighter) or lead ittinerant bands of mercinaries, instead.
Finally, Warlords are able to inspire thier men to great feats of courage and endurance. NPC allies of the warlord add his level to thier morale. Even more remarkably, the Warlord's inspiring leadership can rally men from the very brink of death.
Lead the Attack: With a valiant charge, the Warlord can inspire his allies to attack with increased ferocity. To use this ability, the Warlord must chose a specific enemy and charge that enemy before any other ally has attacked it. The Warlord's allies gain a +2 bonus to attack the same target until that target is killed, surrenders, or flees the combat. Each ally retains this bonus only so long as he attacks the designated target, if he turns his attention to a different enemy, he loses the bonus.
Inspiring Words: A Warlord of at least 3rd level can inspire a wounded comrade to renewed vigour and efforts. The warlord sacrifices one attack he is entitled to this round and instead Inspires an ally who can hear him. The chosen ally regains 1d8 hps per attack the Warlord foregoes that round. If the warlord is entitled to multiple attacks, he can use each to heal a different ally, or heal one ally and command him or another to attack (or attack himself). Each time an ally is healed with Inspiring Words, he must make a Saving Throw vs Death. If he fails the save, his wounds are too severe to be healed by Inspiring Words for the rest of the day. The ally does not have to make a this save if he has taken temporary damage from non-lethal combat or damage from non-physical sources, like Illusions, fear, or other forms of psychic trauma - such 'damage' can always be healed by Inspiring Words.
Rallying Call: Once per day, a Warlord of at least 5th level can rally his troops around him. The Warlord does not move or attack when using his Rallying Cry. Each ally who can hear him recovers hps as if the Warlord had used his available dice of healing from Inspiring Words that round to heal him, alone. If any affected ally is currently under a mind-affecting effect that a saving throw would have negated, he can also make a new saving throw. NPC allies who have been routed are immediately restored to good morale and return to the battle when they hear the Rallying Cry.
Faith in a Friend: Once per day, a Warlord of at least 9th level can inspire a close ally (fellow PC or henchman, not an ordinary hireling or temporary ally of convenience) to shake off the effects of a mortal wound or debilitating afliction long enough to return to the fight. The ally in question must be either at Death's Door, completely helpless, or have been (apparently) slain by an attack since the last time the Warlord acted, and the warlord must be able to see the ally, or the ally must be within the sound of his voice (though, obviously, he may not be conscious to hear it). The Warlord takes no other action for the round, and makes a saving throw vs Spells. If he succeeds, the effect or afliction that has rendered the ally helpless is removed; if he was (apparently) killed by a failed save, he is restored as if the save had been successful; if he was at death's door (or just 'apparently' killed by damage), he is restored to half his normal hps + 3d8 (though no more than his maximum hp total).
Fearsome Warcry: Once per day, a Warlord of at least 11th level can loose a terrible battle-cry that can break the morale of his enemies. Enemies with fewer than 4 levels/HD break and run automatically. Enemies subject to morale checks who hear the warlord must check morale immediately, with a penalty equal to the Warlord's Level + Reaction Adjustment (from Charisma, table 6). Enemies who succeed on thier morale check or who are not subject to morale failure still take a -2 penalty to attack the Warlord and his followers while the Warlord still stands. Any enemy with more than twice the Warlord's HDs/levels is unaffected.
Oooh... level titles:
1 Hussar
2 Seargant
3 Centurion
4 Hipparch
5 Tactician
6 Oberst
7 Brigadier
8 Strategist
9+ Warlord
Oops, looks like this request tried to create an infinite loop. We do not allow such things here. We are a professional website!
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#12 Dec 05, 2009 17:12:28
Tony_Vargas
Joined Sep 2001
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Oh, I forgot race & level resrictions... unfortunately, they're in the 2e dmg, which I don't have handy, but I remember the 1e race/levels vaguely... so this is based on that, for 2e, up it a bit (or up it to match your house rules - many DMs did).
Race Warlord
-------- -------
Dwarf 9
Elf -
Gnome -
Helf-elf 5
Half-orc -
Halfling 8
Human U
*A Dwarf with STR of at least 17 can reach 10th level, one with STR 18 can reach 11th. A halfling with CHA at least 17 can reach 9th, one with CHA 18+ can reach 10th.
Seem about right?
[sblock="comments"]#9 Dec 03, 2009 12:56:57
dragonface
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Holy 2e flashback, Batman!
Initially I was thinking that a 2e warlord could be some sort of reflavored multi-class fighter/cleric with access to the combat, healing, guardian, and protection spheres (rules memory is a little vague, so forgive me if that isn't possible). But Tony_V's write-up looks pretty cool. Only thing I might change would be the Con 10 prereq to Wis 10, just because warlords seem more cerebral than the typical warrior.
I also like the dragonborn suggestions. (I think +1 Str/-1 Dex seems appropriate; they're big and bulky.)
I don't know how well this stuff would work in your game, Aether99, but it looks worth a try. Happy gaming!
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#10 Dec 03, 2009 21:22:23
undrave
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Don't forget the arbitrary limitations. Dragonborns shouldn't be allowed to be Magic-User or Thieves and should always be of Lawful alignement!
Oh and they don't like hobbits. A race needs someone to hate for no real reason XD
58292718 wrote:
I love Horseshoecrabfolk. What I love most about them is that they seem to be the one thing that we all can agree on.
See for yourself, click here!
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#11 Dec 03, 2009 21:39:37
FitzNighteyes
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OK, here's a quick shot at a 2e Warlord.
*shiver*
That's incredible.
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Dec 07, 2009 15:38:31
bone_naga
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OK, here's a quick shot at a 2e Warlord.
Pure awesome. That brings back some nostalgic memories. If only such a class had existed back in the glory days of 2e, I would definitely have rolled on up.
Owner and Proprietor of the House of Trolls. God of ownership and possession.
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#14 Feb 24, 2013 19:34:15
Garthanos
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OK, here's a quick shot at a 2e Warlord.
*shiver*
That's incredible.
shivers.... I think me just broke out in hives.[/sblock]
Oh, and you're free to mock and deride the very idea, and to post lame parodies of the Warlord couched as past edition versions, too. This is not a serious thread! Just have fun with it, for whatever value of 'fun' works for you.
