Off-hand weapons. Meaningless?

Andor

First Post

• Jun 25, 2008

• #1

Does the off-hand weapon trait actually do anything?

If there is a rule that prevents anyone from wielding any two one-handed weapons I can't find it. The off-hand traint and Ranger power make it clear that was the intent, but they apparently forgot to put that rule in. And it would be pretty hard to justify under the 4e paradigm anyway. Does anything stop Don Knotts from carrying a long sword in each hand? Nope. He'd be bad at fighting with them, but the 4e 'no penalties' philosophy hinders them from doing a 3e style "here's how to suck with two weapons" table.

 

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Ziana

First Post

• Jun 25, 2008

• #2

p217: can hold & attack effectively with it in your offhand.

Anything without it therefore, cannot be held and used effectively in the offhand. Rangers with the TWB fighting style get the exception to that.

 

RefinedBean

First Post

• Jun 25, 2008

• #3

Um, no you can go ahead and swing a longsword with one hand, while holding another up in your off-hand to look pretty.

It's fairly pointless, but nothing's stopping ya.

 

Badwe

First Post

• Jun 25, 2008

• #4

Does the bonus to attack rolls with the TWF feat work even if you're holding a weapon in your offhand that you cannot reasonably attack with? Also, it seems to me that the fighter and rogue TWF builds are essentially a thing of the past, I suppose this is fair since without an animal companion or druidic magic the ranger would be hard pressed to differentiate himself from a fighter or rogue otherwise, but what can a rogue do with their free offhand? Everyone else is holding a 2-hander or sporting a shield.

 

Nifft

Penguin Herder

• Jun 25, 2008

• #5

Consider this situation: a Rogue with a rapier in one hand and a dagger in the other.

The Rogue can, without penalty:
- Stab with his rapier (at +3).
- Stab with his dagger (at +4, thanks to a class ability).
- Throw his dagger.


Now consider a Fighter with a longsword in one hand and a javelin in the other.

The Fighter can, without penalty:
- Stab with his longsword (at +3).


Cheers, -- N

 

J

James McMurray

First Post

• Jun 25, 2008

• #6

He could get shield proficiency. Or use a short sword / dagger combo for when he needs to throw something.

 

RefinedBean

First Post

• Jun 25, 2008

• #7

Badwe said:

Does the bonus to attack rolls with the TWF feat work even if you're holding a weapon in your offhand that you cannot reasonably attack with?

Click to expand...

Well, as far as I can see, nothing is stopping you from HOLDING some other one-handed weapon in your off-hand, you just can't wield it towards any effective end. So I'd rule that you don't get the bonus from the feat.

Of course, even if you're getting the bonus from the feat, you might as well just wield a two-handed versatile weapon, get the +1 damage from that property, and save yourself a feat.

 

Tony Vargas

Legend

• Jun 25, 2008

• #8

Nifft said:

Now consider a Fighter with a longsword in one hand and a javelin in the other.

The Fighter can, without penalty:
- Stab with his longsword (at +3).

Click to expand...

Try a hand axe or hammer - it at least gives him the throwing option. If you're just going to carry around a javelin so you don't have to draw it to throw, you might as well just carry it in the same hand as your light shield.

TWF as a style is somewhat worth it for the rogue. It's a +1 extra damage for one feat - at heroic level, competative with Weapon Focus - and a +1 AC/REF for one feat (TWD - as good as becoming proficient in a light shield, and easier from the typical artful dodger to qualify for). Plus, no skill penalty.

Brutal Rogues, OTOH, would be well served to take up shields, as far as AC in combat goes, but still use daggers, for the +1 to hit. And a guy with a big ol' shield and teeny dagger is just funny. (Well, untill kills the **** out of you, anyway).

 

Last edited: Jun 25, 2008

T

The_Fan

First Post

• Jun 25, 2008

• #9

Also, remember you can get two different enchantments on your main and off hand weapons. So it could be worth it if you're fighting something with different vulnerabilities.

 

timbannock

Hero

Supporter

• Jun 25, 2008

• #10

Nifft said:

Consider this situation: a Rogue with a rapier in one hand and a dagger in the other.

The Rogue can, without penalty:
- Stab with his rapier (at +3).
- Stab with his dagger (at +4, thanks to a class ability).
- Throw his dagger.


Now consider a Fighter with a longsword in one hand and a javelin in the other.

The Fighter can, without penalty:
- Stab with his longsword (at +3).


Cheers, -- N

Click to expand...

What's stopping the fighter from tossing the javelin? I hope this isn't a stupid questions, but I feel like it is...