D&D 5E The Case for a Magic Item Shop?

[mcbobbo]

I do not believe that the only way to play is to always be at 100% and that PCs should never be disadvantaged in some way.

I'd go so far as to say that by rejecting magic marts and WBL, etc, 5e represents a deliberate step away from that concept.

You're not intended to have an item for every problem, nor is it assumed that you will.

Again, though, a DM can override this on a per table basis. So I hope we didn't skip that step just to make a case for magic shops.

 

[aramis erak]

Changing the subject slightly, I think that "goggles" are a totally stupid type of magic item for a medieval world. This isn't Splinter Cell. A ring or necklace that grants the same benefit would be more in keeping, IMO.

1) goggles are a late medieval invention. As are glasses.
2) D&D ain't exactly medieval.

The tech base for D&D corresponds nicely to The Dying Earth series, especially the portions about Cugel... mostly medieval, but some really high tech. (Air cars and forcefields, for example.) And it's set when the Sun is expanding...

 

[KarinsDad]

The tech base for D&D corresponds nicely to The Dying Earth series, especially the portions about Cugel... mostly medieval, but some really high tech. (Air cars and forcefields, for example.) And it's set when the Sun is expanding...

Maybe in your campaign.

 

[Grainger]

1) goggles are a late medieval invention. As are glasses.

Yeah, I suppose richer people in a late medieval setting might have classes, and I suppose that most D&D games are set in a hotch-potch of early, high, late medieval and early Renaissance periods. However, goggles that give you night vision? For me, that's more than a step too far.

Now someone's going to say "we have magic, so anything goes", as always happens in discussions of "realism" in genre fiction. Why not, then, have mass entertainment with moving pictures and sound in every peasant's home... but powered by magic? You could do that if you want, but if the flavour you want is broadly medieval, as most D&D games are, then I submit that a magic ring is better for the setting than special forces night vision goggles.

Of course, you don't have to go with a medieval feel; it just depends on what you want, but I'd suggest avoiding items that might jolt players out of the setting, whatever that may be. One such setting might be "medieval, but with plenty of anachronistic elements", and of course that's fine... as long as that's what you're actually going for.

 

[ZombieRoboNinja]

This may have already been brought up in the 900 pages of this thread I haven't read, but the op's scenario (on an unexpected quest through the Underdark without extra time or resources to seek out a special item) is almost the opposite of "the case for a magic item shop." If you can't take the time to seek out a wizard or alchemist, why would you have the time to go by Leroy's Wondrous Item Emporium for your darkvision Oakleys?

 

[KarinsDad]

This may have already been brought up in the 900 pages of this thread I haven't read, but the op's scenario (on an unexpected quest through the Underdark without extra time or resources to seek out a special item) is almost the opposite of "the case for a magic item shop." If you can't take the time to seek out a wizard or alchemist, why would you have the time to go by Leroy's Wondrous Item Emporium for your darkvision Oakleys?

As you imply, one wouldn't.

 

[Hussar]

There have been other times we have played with disadvantages for longer than a few sessions. At ninth level we choose to run after being captured and we left everything behind our weapons, armor the wizard's spellbook and all our magic items. We were trapped in unfriendly lands and it took around six sessions to get home. Yes it was hard but we had to learn to work together and think outside the box to make it through and you know what it as a blast.

And no the player is not as a disadvantage as you make out they can use a lantern when fighting so they are not limited in combat their perception does not rule out listen and scent. What they are disadvantage at is to scout. So maybe it is time for another PC to pick up that and scout while in this situation.

Also the player has said that they don't want to find magic items because that is to cheesy. The OP is trying to make a point about how there should be magic marts. I don't think they have done that. We have no clue if the OP has talked to the DM. There are many ways to solve this without putting in magic goggles. There are limited use items that would work just as well like scrolls, potions even alchemy items.

I do not believe that the only way to play is to always be at 100% and that PCs should never be disadvantaged in some way.

Again, note that the entire group was stripped of their equipment.

Try that scenario again, but, this time, only your character loses all her equipment for the next six sessions.

Do you have the same amount of fun?

 

[Hussar]

Yeah, I suppose richer people in a late medieval setting might have classes, and I suppose that most D&D games are set in a hotch-potch of early, high, late medieval and early Renaissance periods. However, goggles that give you night vision? For me, that's more than a step too far.

Now someone's going to say "we have magic, so anything goes", as always happens in discussions of "realism" in genre fiction. Why not, then, have mass entertainment with moving pictures and sound in every peasant's home... but powered by magic? You could do that if you want, but if the flavour you want is broadly medieval, as most D&D games are, then I submit that a magic ring is better for the setting than special forces night vision goggles.

Of course, you don't have to go with a medieval feel; it just depends on what you want, but I'd suggest avoiding items that might jolt players out of the setting, whatever that may be. One such setting might be "medieval, but with plenty of anachronistic elements", and of course that's fine... as long as that's what you're actually going for.

You do realise that the Inuit wore goggles nearly two thousand years ago. Goggles are not a new invention.

 

[Hussar]

Cannot use any perception type skills?

I must have missed the rules that covered losing hearing and sense of smell when in darkness.

Well, it does help to read the rules. Might be enlightening. Disadvantage on all perception checks.

Useless in combat? Good to know all that training goes right out the window when the lights go out. If you are doing a great deal of fighting while scouting then you are probably doing it wrong.

Complete darkness? Well, disadvantage on all attacks. No sneak attacks possible. Have to guess the location of all targets - need to make a perception check (at disadvantage) to locate the target square.

Boo hoo hoo I'm not at maximum effectiveness in the dark so throw me a gewgaw to nullify the disadvantages I chose at character creation, is not a good reason to include magic item shops.

Not too long ago there was quite a fit being thrown by some because of the mere existence of gauntlets of ogre power. " OMG!! these things give you a 19STR! If I give my fighter any STR when I create the character then get these, it will invalidate my whole build!!!"

How is this any different?

If anyone can just run out and grab a doodad off the shelf to compensate for shortcomings due to race or class why have choices? "Hey I could have rolled a drow or something but human gives a feat at first level and I'll just grab a pair of goggles to see in the dark with anyhow?"

Public Service Announcement:

Please create a character you will be happy to play without a guarantee of ever getting item X.

Yeah, this isn't toxic at all.

Hey, if a player tells you that he isn't having fun in your game, that means you failed as a DM. End of story. If a player is having a bad time, that's your fault. That you can continue to play and not care that your player is having a bad time speaks volumes about your DMing and a lot less about the players.

Me, if a player is having a bad time, I'm having a bad time. A great part of my enjoyment of the game as a DM comes from the idea that I'm providing a good time for the people sitting around the table with me. Obviously, opinions vary and some DM's feel it's perfectly fine to waste the time of their players on session after frustrating session of the player disliking the game.

No wonder we keep bleeding players to video games with DM advice like this.

 

[Random Bystander]

Fun >>> Gaming book rules, and the opinion of people not in your gaming group.

Discuss it with your players; figure out what they're fine with and what'll break immersion for them. Go with what's most fun. For some people, that means slogging through until they could "realistically" get some new ones. For others, MagicMart. So stop arguing about badwrongfun and just have fun.

It's a game, not real life. And no-one's being punched in the face.