D&D 5E Mearls' "Firing" tweet

[Tanin Wulf]

I see no reason to draw the conclusion about his tweet that you have, given he doesn't say anything like what you're assuming he means, and what you're assuming he means is so far from the plain words he used that if that really is what he meant than once again I think my point is well proved that he said it poorly.

Is there no happy middle ground between reading too much into words and not reading enough into them?

(I say that with no context or knowledge of who any of these 'people who have been hounding...' are or anything about that.)

 

[Kobold Boots]

I can see the reason behind doing this Gatekeeper duty that I'm being scrutinized for, and even why it's happening. I'm hoping soon the irony will be noticed...

You're welcome.

Just keep in mind that gatekeeping your group is one thing and gatekeeping the rules/game is an entirely different matter.

I doubt that anyone would care about doing a test session with someone and deciding they weren't right for your group. I do think that combining it with gender and rules gatekeeping then posting about it is a conscious decision to throw gas on the thread.

Be well
KB

PS. This is written from the point of view of someone who has been notoriously picky about creating a team when recruiting players because I try to balance personalities, gender etc. I like a mixed group with different strengths. Probably why I'm not gaming right now.. but the practice has limits, lines that can't be crossed.

 

[Mistwell]

[MENTION=2525]Mistwell[/MENTION]: I don't think the word "gatekeeping" means the same thing to you that it does to me.

I am sure it means exactly what I think it means. If you want a clarification you have but to ask. Gatekeeping rightfuly has a negative connotation when it comes to discriminatory issues towards women and minorities, but as a general word it doesn't necessarily have a negative connotation at all. For example, to become a university professor one often must overcome a series of intentional barriers erected by the senior people of that profession, some of which are communication barriers, some of them political (as in social politics) barriers, as a means of gatekeeping the position of faculty member.

Tell you what, go to a MENSA game day event (I am not a member of MENSA by the way, I just had some brief experiences at their game day events). You will see rules gatekeeping on full display. You will also see it has nothing to do with gender and in fact may well find the majority of people exercising pleasure in that rules gatekeeping is being done by women there.

I am wondering if maybe the only context some people have encountered the word gatekeeping is at it applies to discrimination against women and minorities and have not encountered the word in a context that doesn't involve those issues? It didn't come from that arena of issues. It's a word from the 1920s I believe, which I think started in journalism.

 

[Mistwell]

I feel like with the stuff you're posting, you have neither seen or experienced gatekeeping.

Of course I have seen it and experienced it. I suspect you have not experienced it OUTSIDE of discrimination against women and minorities, and think that's the only form of it's existence (despite the fact that's actually a new use of a much older concept and term).

 

[77IM]

I am sure it means exactly what I think it means.

I don't think the word "means" means the same thing to you that it does to me.

 

[Tanin Wulf]

Just keep in mind that gatekeeping your group is one thing and gatekeeping the rules/game is an entirely different matter.

I doubt that anyone would care about doing a test session with someone and deciding they weren't right for your group. I do think that combining it with gender and rules gatekeeping then posting about it is a conscious decision to throw gas on the thread.

I completely agree! But I have never seen anyone gatekeeping the rules or the game (except for things like Paranoia, where it's part of the joke). I have seen people gatekeeping (negatively) their community.

Maybe I'm approaching this from too much of an, "all politics is local," mindset.

 

[Kobold Boots]

I am sure it means exactly what I think it means. If you want a clarification you have but to ask. Gatekeeping rightfuly has a negative connotation when it comes to discriminatory issues towards women and minorities, but as a general word it doesn't necessarily have a negative connotation at all. For example, to become a university professor one often must overcome a series of intentional barriers erected by the senior people of that profession, some of which are communication barriers, some of them political (as in social politics) barriers, as a means of gatekeeping the position of faculty member.

Tell you what, go to a MENSA game day event (I am not a member of MENSA by the way, I just had some brief experiences at their game day events). You will see rules gatekeeping on full display. You will also see it has nothing to do with gender and in fact may well find the majority of people exercising pleasure in that rules gatekeeping is being done by women there.

I am wondering if maybe the only context some people have encountered the word gatekeeping is at it applies to discrimination against women and minorities and have not encountered the word in a context that doesn't involve those issues? It didn't come from that arena of issues. It's a word from the 1920s I believe, which I think started in journalism.

MENSA isn't a great example, simply because the organization itself is an example of gatekeeping. The intent of the current design team of D&D is that it should not be.

KB
- A member of MENSA since 1990.

 

[Mistwell]

Mearls seems to be meaning using complex rules mastery and minute lore knowledge as weapons to keep the hobby small and insular. Which is precisely opposite of the design goals of 5E.

Sent from my [device_name] using EN World mobile app

I agree I suspect that's how he's using it. The assumption that's about keeping women out however seems flawed to me. The gatekeepers of D&D want to keep it small and insular as a generalization and often regardless of gender. I don't think it's actually linked to the issue he's trying to link it to, and I don't think he has a shred of evidence to support his assumption the two are connected.

 

[hawkeyefan]

I am wondering if maybe the only context some people have encountered the word gatekeeping is at it applies to discrimination against women and minorities and have not encountered the word in a context that doesn't involve those issues? It didn't come from that arena of issues. It's a word from the 1920s I believe, which I think started in journalism.

Perhaps because that's the relevant definition in the context of Mearls's tweet and in this conversation?

The doorman of an apartment building performs some positive type of gatekeeping. So does a security guard at a bank. But that doesn't really have anything to do with this conversation.

Mearls was citing gatekeeping of the game....keeping it for the few....by using rules and lore as a barrier to newer folks, as a negative thing, and then observing that many who do that also seem to have a problem with women being involved in gaming.

 

[Kobold Boots]

I agree I suspect that's how he's using it. The assumption that's about keeping women out however seems flawed to me. The gatekeepers of D&D want to keep it small and insular as a generalization and often regardless of gender. I don't think it's actually linked to the issue he's trying to link it to, and I don't think he has a shred of evidence to support his assumption the two are connected.

I don't know that it matters if he has a shred of evidence if he's simply stating his opinion based on his experiences. Twitter is not supposed to be a peer-reviewed journal. Moreover, as long as I'm on this point, ENWorld isn't a peer-reviewed journal and he didn't submit his thoughts to us to be reviewed