What is and isn't Space Opera?

[MarkB]

Well, to compare "soap opera" and "space opera", I get:

1.It's huge, complex, detailed and obtuse. Unless you start at the beginning, it is utterly impossible to just watch an episode or two and "understand and get" what is going on in the story. Your ONLY option is to watch the whole show, and you have to accept that for some time you will be clueless and won't "get" things in the show.

2.There are lots and lots and lots and lots of characters. Characters come and go, and can be very hard to keep track of in the story.

3.No Main Characters. While a story thread my feature a character, they are by no means a "main" character. As the story moves along, old characters will fade and new ones get a spotlight. No character has plot armor and can die at any time. No character is the "special chosen one" that the whole universe revolves around.

4.Long storytelling with no short cuts. When the planet Pangus makes a space force, we get to see it slowly be built over a vast course of time. If a character falls for some addiction it's a plot point for a long, long time. There are no quick fixes or reset buttons.

5.There is no Hollywood Endings like the demi god super hero character shoots a thingy and ALL of the alien/robot/whatevers in the whole army are automatically defeated. Heroes do not disarm bombs by cutting the red wire with one second left. Things are done the hard way. The only way for a rebels to defeat the evil empire is by and endless war of attrition until the empire can't fight back.

So, Dune, then?

 

[Twiggly the Gnome]

So, Dune, then?

Spoiler

Duncan Idaho

sort of defies the third point.

 

[Umbran]

Fine.

It's still wrong.

And since you are the one making the outrageous claim, it falls to you to provide evidence that writing in the 1940s was drier than the writing of the 2020s.

Dude. What's with the aggressive approach?

I am stating a personal estimation - "I think," rather than "I know". I am not presenting it as fact. So no particular proof is required, because, and here's a big point - I am not arguing about it.

You don't agree? That's cool. My life has room for people to disagree with me.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Dude. What's with the aggressive approach?

Literature is under attack from all different directions, I think it needs defending.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Well, to compare "soap opera" and "space opera", I get:

1.It's huge, complex, detailed and obtuse. Unless you start at the beginning, it is utterly impossible to just watch an episode or two and "understand and get" what is going on in the story. Your ONLY option is to watch the whole show, and you have to accept that for some time you will be clueless and won't "get" things in the show.

2.There are lots and lots and lots and lots of characters. Characters come and go, and can be very hard to keep track of in the story.

3.No Main Characters. While a story thread my feature a character, they are by no means a "main" character. As the story moves along, old characters will fade and new ones get a spotlight. No character has plot armor and can die at any time. No character is the "special chosen one" that the whole universe revolves around.

4.Long storytelling with no short cuts. When the planet Pangus makes a space force, we get to see it slowly be built over a vast course of time. If a character falls for some addiction it's a plot point for a long, long time. There are no quick fixes or reset buttons.

5.There is no Hollywood Endings like the demi god super hero character shoots a thingy and ALL of the alien/robot/whatevers in the whole army are automatically defeated. Heroes do not disarm bombs by cutting the red wire with one second left. Things are done the hard way. The only way for a rebels to defeat the evil empire is by and endless war of attrition until the empire can't fight back.

This sounds more like a list of "stuff I like" rather than anything recognisable as Space Opera.

It's a good list, mind.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Space Opera, Soap Opera, Horse Opera. Why OPERA? It clearly doesn't mean the story is told through song.

In understanding the terminology, it is important to understand that the term was intended as an INSULT.

So, when coined, it was intended to mean "has the same negative characteristics as opera". So, what negative characteristics are commonly associated with opera? I would suggest something like this: over-long, over-dramatic, over-stated, histrionic, self-important, pretentious, mythic.

If you want evidence, go see some Wagner!

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Spoiler

Duncan Idaho

sort of defies the third point.

 

[Yora]

I don't think long term development can't be a criteria for a genre. A series of works does not start as one genre and then transforms into another genre once it reaches a certain length and overturn of characters.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

I don't think long term development can't be a criteria for a genre. A series of works does not start as one genre and then transforms into another genre once it reaches a certain length and overturn of characters.

Genre labels are usually applied retroactively. See the Lensman series.

You don't sit down and say "I'm writing a space opera". You sit down and say "I'm writing a story about a bunch of characters who become involved in an intergalactic war".

 

[Yora]

Maybe some people. Probably mostly in the past when the genre wasn't yet established.