D&D General When do you overrule RAW?

[Jahydin]

One of the unique aspects of TTRPGs is there is a living, breathing gamemaster that can make complicated decisions on the fly when the rules fall short.

I lean into that advantage heavily.

 

[CreamCloud0]

Except at no point in 5e does any class stop being able to do anything. And if you think not bring able to use Sentinal is worse than losing cantrips through 3ed level spells, I have a few bridges to sell you.

So you are still grossly misrepresenting things.

I’m really struggling to understand your perspective here, as so many more of martials already limited toolset are designed to exist in that area of ‘low grade’ banned abilities, the impact of that rule has so much more of an effect on them than casters, fighters loose near all their battle opportunities when their abilities can’t be used but spell slots that casters can’t use aren’t lost, and they can still use those slots indirectly, using a 1st level slot for shield or healing word or jump, and they still have the ability to deal significant damage and control the battle just by resorting to 4th+ spells, what can a martial switch to when sentinel or their manoeuvres fail for being ‘too low-grade’? Because all the rest of their abilities are also on that same level

The caster might loose their at wills and their lower grade spells, but they’ve got more than enough other resources that that’s not really a huge concern on their capability to act.

 

[Oofta]

I’m really struggling to understand your perspective here, as so many more of martials already limited toolset are designed to exist in that area of ‘low grade’ banned abilities, the impact of that rule has so much more of an effect on them than casters, fighters loose near all their battle opportunities when their abilities can’t be used but spell slots that casters can’t use aren’t lost, and they can still use those slots indirectly, using a 1st level slot for shield or healing word or jump, and they still have the ability to deal significant damage and control the battle just by resorting to 4th+ spells, what can a martial switch to when sentinel or their manoeuvres fail for being ‘too low-grade’? Because all the rest of their abilities are also on that same level

The caster might loose their at wills and their lower grade spells, but they’ve got more than enough other resources that that’s not really a huge concern on their capability to act.

Don't we already have enough threads on how much some people think fighters suck? Can you take this over to one of those?

 

[Reynard]

Don't we already have enough threads on how much some people think fighters suck? Can you take this over to one of those?

You're Ike 300 posts late. It started immediately.

 

[Scott Christian]

I was watching the Critical Role special from Wembley, and there comes a moment where the party is fighting a kaiju-sized opponent and a character, Bo, tries to use a reaction attack from the sentinel feat to stop it moving after another party member. The attack is successful, but Mercer immediately overrules it, asking the player (his wife) “how do you do that?”, to which she had no real answer. Note that after missing on the initial attack she had spent her only reroll to try again, believing that immobilizing the monster was critical.

I agreed with his ruling - her comparatively tiny character somehow locking down a massive supernatural creature to whom she was insignificant would have made no sense in the story. But I know others would have very different feelings. So my question is: when do you feel justified overruling RAW?

Late to the game. So sorry if this has been said.

But the most important part of this is him asking the player, "How does your PC do this?"

I have made calls as DM, that I thought fit the story better. But have asked prior to the call. Sometimes the players are creative and surprise you. If I remember correctly, there have even been times the player asked, or I asked, after the call.

 

[Oofta]

You're Ike 300 posts late. It started immediately.

Just because you've pulled one weed from the garden it doesn't mean you stop pulling.

 

[James Gasik]

Don't we already have enough threads on how much some people think fighters suck? Can you take this over to one of those?

This doesn't just affect Fighters, but any time a character is denied the use of an ability they possess on the whim of the DM, and how non-magical abilities tend to be scrutinized with greater detail than magical ones.

If, in your mind, any such discussion instantly equals "Fighters suck", I don't know what to tell you. You've gone on record saying that you either don't believe any of these things actually happen, or if they do, that they're not a problem for you or anyone you have ever gamed with, regardless of how many people have a different point of view.

When people claim to have a problem, real or imagined, the fact that they perceive a problem is, in of itself, a matter worth discussing. And when that problem is relevant to other discussions, as I believe it is here, I don't see why it should be isolated to other threads.

You don't have to tell me you disagree, I'm wildly aware of that fact.

 

[Oofta]

This doesn't just affect Fighters, but any time a character is denied the use of an ability they possess on the whim of the DM, and how non-magical abilities tend to be scrutinized with greater detail than magical ones.

If, in your mind, any such discussion instantly equals "Fighters suck", I don't know what to tell you. You've gone on record saying that you either don't believe any of these things actually happen, or if they do, that they're not a problem for you or anyone you have ever gamed with, regardless of how many people have a different point of view.

When people claim to have a problem, real or imagined, the fact that they perceive a problem is, in of itself, a matter worth discussing. And when that problem is relevant to other discussions, as I believe it is here, I don't see why it should be isolated to other threads.

You don't have to tell me you disagree, I'm wildly aware of that fact.

This thread is about overriding RAW, not the limits of specific classes. I get tired of every single thread that even touches on classes even tangentially getting sidetracked. Because I am also aware of what a half dozen or so people think of the fighter class. They don't need to remind us on every thread possible.

Can we just for once not derail another thread? Please?

 

[Mort]

Late to the game. So sorry if this has been said.

But the most important part of this is him asking the player, "How does your PC do this?"

I have made calls as DM, that I thought fit the story better. But have asked prior to the call. Sometimes the players are creative and surprise you. If I remember correctly, there have even been times the player asked, or I asked, after the call.

I think, ideally (IMO of course), the DMs line of thought and inquiry should be "how can I make your action fit into what I think is going on in the fiction..." And the DM should work with the player to get the action to fit (in a way they both conceptualize working) .

To often, I see DMs act as goalies, who think their job is to intercept/disallow any act that doesn't fit their idea of the fiction/what's going on. And I think this is backwards.

 

[Maxperson]

I’m really struggling to understand your perspective here, as so many more of martials already limited toolset are designed to exist in that area of ‘low grade’ banned abilities, the impact of that rule has so much more of an effect on them than casters, fighters loose near all their battle opportunities when their abilities can’t be used but spell slots that casters can’t use aren’t lost, and they can still use those slots indirectly, using a 1st level slot for shield or healing word or jump, and they still have the ability to deal significant damage and control the battle just by resorting to 4th+ spells, what can a martial switch to when sentinel or their manoeuvres fail for being ‘too low-grade’? Because all the rest of their abilities are also on that same level

The caster might loose their at wills and their lower grade spells, but they’ve got more than enough other resources that that’s not really a huge concern on their capability to act.

It's simple. If I remove a single feat from martials and a third of the class(assuming the ability to cast 9th levels spells) from spellcasters, there's no possible way it can be perceived as being aimed at martials or hitting martials harder. It simply can't rationally be perceived that way. This guy is trying to tell me that I'm being harder on martials if I do that, and he's flat out wrong and misrepresenting.