jmartkdr2
Hero
And that's how we get 47 different kinds of elves each with about a sentence worth of distinct lore.
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D&D (2024) No Dwarf, Halfling, and Orc suborgins, lineages, and legacies
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Corinnguard
Hero
More like 47 different elven cultures if we went with the Level Up approach.
But that would require an additional book or books. The Ultimately Complete Book of Elves. 
TwoSix
"Diegetics", by L. Ron Gygax
I said 5%. @Micah Sweet said they didn't like that number; the rest of their statement implied they wanted the 5% to be bigger and the remainder smaller. I suggested a method to "split the difference", granting more mechanical weight to the race overall (thus increasing the overall percentage to more than 5%) by adding on some post-character creation mechanics to allow for opt-in mechanical heft; their existence would also provide trope strengthening by their simple presence within the game rules. But since the bulk of the mechanical weight is post-character creation, that still allows for ample room for those who want to define their character against trope definitions to do so.
TwoSix
"Diegetics", by L. Ron Gygax
You certainly can do it (and I know what you're thinking of, but no need to derail
). A core issue, I think, is that race-as-class generally argues for races being relatively insular with distinct societies; I think a lot of more modern fantasy approaches lean towards various races living together in a fairly cosmopolitan manner.
Remathilis
Legend
Sure. You have the dwarf (fighter). And the dwarf crusader (cleric) and the dwarf locksmith (thief) and the dwarf artificer (wizard) and the dwarf caver (ranger) and the dwarf skald (bard) and the dwarf battlerager (barbarian), etc etc. Maybe we can put them in separate books so that if you don't have Bruenors Guide to Mithral Hall, you can't play a dwarf priest.
Or, you know, just open the 12 classes to all races and quit reinventing the wheel...
Micah Sweet
Level Up & OSR Enthusiast
Then add more lore. It's really not rocket science.
Micah Sweet
Level Up & OSR Enthusiast
I like multiple approaches to an issue in game design. You put like three different option per race in the corebook, and save the rest for a supplement.
Or don't. Do what you want. I like options and alternatives.
It was only a problem because so many of them were tied to FR & great wheel even when they should have slotted into other settings & because elf was pretty muc the goto
Micah Sweet
Level Up & OSR Enthusiast
That's true, but it's a matter of taste. I'm not a fan of cosmopolitan being assumed as the default that the rules all rally around, no matter popular it seems to be in modern fantasy gaming. How about we allow for both combined and separate cultures, and stop insisting that everything be the way the current feelings want it to be?You certainly can do it (and I know what you're thinking of, but no need to derail
Kobold Avenger
Legend
I definitely don't want Orcs being banned from being Wizards or the choice of having an Orc as a Wizard be at an extreme disadvantage. Which is why I'm fine with the de-emphasis on ability bonuses.
If you're an Orc that's a Wizard, you simply pick +2 Intelligence (since that's most important) and then maybe throw in +1 Constitution (or the less useful to Wizards +1 Strength) as a reminder the Wizard's Orcishness.
Yes optimizers might say that being able to dash as a bonus action and gain some temp HP, being able to lift and carry more and not falling unconscious when reduced to 0 hp, might not add much to being a Wizard. But certainly some of those Orcish abilities do have some uses even for Wizards.
If you're an Orc that's a Wizard, you simply pick +2 Intelligence (since that's most important) and then maybe throw in +1 Constitution (or the less useful to Wizards +1 Strength) as a reminder the Wizard's Orcishness.
Yes optimizers might say that being able to dash as a bonus action and gain some temp HP, being able to lift and carry more and not falling unconscious when reduced to 0 hp, might not add much to being a Wizard. But certainly some of those Orcish abilities do have some uses even for Wizards.
