D&D 5E The Magical Martial

dave2008

Legend
I think the issue people find with your idea is that it limits heroes to those that are not mundane. Someone referred to it as ‘baby Hercules’. Because if a hero can progress in martial prowess past that mundane point then they never really were mundane to begin with and/or some supernatural power granting event had to occur right at level up (which is also a problem for people)

I think if you do the level split explanation you have to take great care to explain how these issues can be avoided if desired. (Essentially campaign level cap or starting point and why you would want to use those).
That is a good point. I guess my initial thought is that it is a hard break, like lvl 20 in 5e. If you go past this point you are saying this the type of game you want to play. Otherwise, stay level 1-10. The game is full featured in levels 1-10 (in 5e terms take everything in 1-20 and mush it down to 1-10).

That may not satisfy everyone, but I am not looking to satisfy everyone.
 

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FrogReaver

As long as i get to be the frog
Because the combat abstraction is terribly boring and by design offers very little narrative control?
Different people find different things boring so can’t argue there.

But D&d isn’t a game that offers much narrative control, players don’t typically pick the results of their actions.
 


dave2008

Legend
Again.

Why can't I play level 17 Hawkeye, Deadshot, Usopp, Batman, Kenshin, or Cap and stay non-supernatursl like the source material?
You can. Like I said, the level of the cap is irrelevant. It could be at level 50. My point is that there is a line somewhere. I just chose 10 for the reasons I stated. Level only means what we decide it means. You can have a full featured game that is only 10 levels (or 5).

So, why can't you have Hawkeye, Deadshot, Usopp, Batman, Kenshin play at level 7?
 
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Stormonu

Legend
Not like that.

Right now when my fighter attacks I can narrate him doing this super awesome twirling strike that ends with a cross slash. I can throw in some awesome jumping, rolling on the ground or whatever. I think that’s how it mostly should be, and the obsession with having a mechanic and mechanical subsystem for everything ends up taking away far more from my characterization of my attacks than it adds.
That brings up an interesting point.

Champion Fighter (with Remarkable Athlete) can make a high jump of 11 feet max at 20th level (8 feet if I'm interpreting it incorrectly), without magic.

Same fighter can take a flying leap off a 200 ft. cliff and after hitting bottom, can get up, dust themselves off and go do it a second time. Maybe 3 times if they took the Tough feat.

So why is it okay the fighter can do the fall without it being considered supernatural, but can barely beat/match the world record high jump (8 1/4 feet)?
 

FrogReaver

As long as i get to be the frog
That brings up an interesting point.

Champion Fighter (with Remarkable Athlete) can make a high jump of 11 feet max at 20th level (8 feet if I'm interpreting it incorrectly), without magic.

Same fighter can take a flying leap off a 200 ft. cliff and after hitting bottom, can get up, dust themselves off and go do it a second time. Maybe 3 times if they took the Tough feat.

So why is it okay the fighter can do the fall without it being considered supernatural, but can barely beat/match the world record high jump (8 1/4 feet)?
I’m not concerned with the line between supernatural and not supernatural.

I am concerned with the spectrum of supernatural. Just barely above non-supernatural to the most amazingly supernatural powers ever dreamt of.

So let’s suppose falling like that is supernatural? So what? It doesn’t mean the fighter should be any more supernatural than that.
 

CreamCloud0

One day, I hope to actually play DnD.
So, why can't you have Hawkeye, Deadshot, Usopp, Batman, Kenshin play at level 7?
you already can, more or less, but nobody tells the people with the magic class fantasies 'oh sorry you can only play below 10th level, or compromise your desired aesthetic' it's a double standard.

or maybe flip the standard on it's head, say you can't play any magic classes on a character below 10th level? how would people feel about that?
 

FrogReaver

As long as i get to be the frog
That is a good point. I guess my initial thought is that it is a hard break, like lvl 20 in 5e. If you go past this point you are saying this the type of game you want to play. Otherwise, stay level 1-10. The game is full featured in levels 1-10 (in 5e terms take everything in 1-20 and mush it down to 1-10).

That may not satisfy everyone, but I am not looking to satisfy everyone.
My personal favorite at the moment would be classes go to level 1-10. Then you can choose a paragon class from level 11-20 (kind of like a prestige class from 3e). Paragon class would compliment your abilities and provide an explanation for how you are progressing to supernatural levels of power.
 

FrogReaver

As long as i get to be the frog
you already can, more or less, but nobody tells the people with the magic class fantasies 'oh sorry you can only play below 10th level, or compromise your desired aesthetic' it's a double standard.
Magic is always supernatural. It can be toned down to be on par with non-supernatural, but it can also scale up to be one of the strongest supernatural forces in the world.

Martial prowess need not be supernatural.
 


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