D&D (2024) WotC Fireside Chat: Revised 2024 Player’s Handbook

tetrasodium · Apr 26, 2024

Raiztt said:
It would obviously solve a lot of internet debates, but I don't think we all here collectively represent a large enough demographic for these concerns to ever matter to corporate.

Weirdly that is both untrue and a self fulfilling prophecy

Raiztt · Apr 26, 2024

tetrasodium said:
Weirdly that is both untrue and a self fulfilling prophecy

You believe that even 10% of D&D players participate in online forums...?

Steampunkette · Apr 26, 2024

Raiztt said:
This is not a sufficient explanation for the person you're responding to because it's not an in-world explanation.

I mean... Maybe, yeah.

Answer remains the same, though. Writer says so.

The writer dictates the rule of the world, the way those rules are reflected in the reality of the world, etc etc and so on and so forth.

All of them start with "Our Normal World" as a baseline with assumptions about gravity and the rate at which the world orbits the nearest star... but then gets -weird- with it after that point.

"Your world's got a normal moon? Child's play! You need at -least- 3 moons and a bunch of broken moonlike material and probably a planet with rings dominating half your sky for a month or two every year..."

Remathilis · Apr 26, 2024

Steampunkette said:
Because the writer says so.

From the perspective of someone living in the world, Magic is as normal as Orcs and Elves and Dwarves. Even if from our perspective they're weird and wild and unusual.

Just 'cause -we- don't have sufficiently advanced technology and orcs and elves and dwarves... grumbles

So your opinion is that it's completely arbitrary.

And if the 24 PHB said all fighters contain shards of the divinity of the God of War, that's fine because the writers said so. Just making sure we're clear.

Charlaquin · Apr 26, 2024

Micah Sweet said:
That is your perspective, not mine. Of course the PC isn't going to see it the same way as the player. But the player is the real person using the rules and trying to understand how the setting works, so their perspective IMO simply matters more.

Remember, we’re having this conversation in the context of what martial classes characters’ limits should be. What is possible in real life may be more important to you personally than what is possible in-character, but it does not matter for setting the parameters of martial characters’ capabilities. Even if what you’re saying is that you don’t want martial characters to be capable of anything that isn’t possible in real life, that would mean you want what’s possible from an in-character perspective to match 1:1 with what’s possible in real life. What’s possible from an in-character perspective is still the relevant factor in setting martial characters’ limits though.

Micah Sweet said:
There's also the issue @Remathilis mentioned above: by your definition, everything is innately magical (but no one cares because that's just the way the world works), so every class is magical AND none of them are. When you say you don't like the word 'magical, are you talking about spells; as in, do only creatures who use spells count as magical?

I don’t dislike the word magical, I just want martial characters to be capable of things beyond the limits of real-world physics, without those things being defined as magical in the setting. That is to say, those things should be possible within the rules that govern the setting.

As for if only spells should be considered magic, not necessarily in my opinion. I’d follow Jeremy Crawford’s guidance in Sage Advice: if a feature is a spell, reproduces the effect of a spell, or is explicitly defined as “magic” or “magical” in its description, it’s magic. Otherwise, it’s not.

Oofta · Apr 26, 2024

Steampunkette said:
Because Ghosts don't exist but some people believe they do. So it's supernatural. Just like people believe there's actually Psionics in the real world.

And, of course, the supernatural "Exists" in stories as reflections of the real world. Even though ghosts have always existed within the world of Ebenezer Scrooge, they're not common enough in their interactions with humans to be normal and they don't exist in reality, so supernatural describes them just fine.

Except in a world where anything that exist is no longer supernatural, ghosts would no longer be supernatural. Kind of like how people once though gorillas were a myth. The words supernatural and magic have meaning for the players of the game, that's all that matters.

I find supernatural and magical useful for describing things. In general anything supernatural is unaffected by dispel magic or antimagic zones because those supernatural things were not brought into existence by direct manipulation using a spell. There are exceptions to every rule including this one of course. So a +1 sword is magical because it was created by a wizard casting a spell of some sort artificially imbuing it with power. A ghost is just a ghost, something we would consider a supernatural being.

Remathilis · Apr 26, 2024

Oofta said:
A ghost is just a ghost, something we would consider a supernatural being.

In D&D I guess a ghost is not an encounter with the paranormal but just another member of society. Ghost Unalives Matter and all that.

tetrasodium · Apr 26, 2024

Raiztt said:
You believe that even 10% of D&D players participate in online forums...?

Huh? 489 & 531 were talking about players I see who exhibit the behavior describe both in those posts and the one quoted in 489. Participating to online forums is about as relevant as hair color or fillable PDF printout vra hand filled printout preferences. When a player doesn't try to participate in anything but close to melee>smash>repeat it creates a situation where they obviously wont

Cadence · Apr 26, 2024

Steampunkette said:
Because the writers say so!

But. Like. From a "Real World" standpoint, it's not supernatural at all. It's totally normal for characters in that world to wish and have something actually happen rather than wishing just being a thing that gets nothing done.

It feels like it depends on the world they're in. Do lots of stories (maybe Arthurian, Tolkien, Lord Darcy, Earthsea, etc...) have magic but it is called out as magic even if it is a well-known part of their world. In some is magic just assumed and not special? (the Marvel Thor stories anywhere in the nine-realms except midgard?). In others is it an outside and scary thing? (movies like Poltergeist).

Charlaquin said:
That sounds so cool though!

Similarly, does how cool it is depend on the world the story is in? Does Little John spinning his quarterstaff fast enough to make a vortex work in a bugs bunny cartoon but not something going for an accentuated medieval England with magic? Does Robin splitting arrows easily work in both? Does easily jumping a 30' look like one thing when Batman does it vs. having Kojak or Magnum P.I. do it?

Steampunkette · Apr 26, 2024

Remathilis said:
So your opinion is that it's completely arbitrary.

And if the 24 PHB said all fighters contain shards of the divinity of the God of War, that's fine because the writers said so. Just making sure we're clear.

In the same way the "Weave" is the source of all magic is fine because the writers said so, yes.

It's information I'll be ignoring in my own settings and games 'cause I don't like it. But I'm not afraid to look at someone else's writing and go all Nick Fury "I have elected to ignore it"

And then just wander off on my merry way enjoying the material I and other people write. Because I am the writer, you see, of the worlds I play in.

Well. Unless someone else wants to run a game. In which case I buy-in to whatever their world is. Or not, if I don't like the material they're using.

Because Suspension of Disbelief is a thing.

D&D (2024) WotC Fireside Chat: Revised 2024 Player’s Handbook

tetrasodium

Legend

Raiztt

Adventurer

Steampunkette

Rules Tinkerer and Freelance Writer

Remathilis

Legend

Charlaquin

Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)

Oofta

Legend

Remathilis

Legend

tetrasodium

Legend

Cadence

Legend

Steampunkette

Rules Tinkerer and Freelance Writer

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