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While not disagreeing with anything you say here, I was specifically referring to the sections on cooperative worldbuilding, asking players questions and building upon the answers, PC relationship structures that anticipated Apocalypse World's Hx by about 2 years, terrain powers as an expansion...

Kinda surprised nobody mentioned the DMG2 in response to this ..

Just as an aside, 4E's DMG2 does have a section on establishing relationships between the PCs akin to Apocalypse World's Hx. If I recall correctly, you set up a positive relationship to the PC of the player sitting on your right and set up a conflicted relationship to the player sitting on your...

That particular example was also printed in the DMG2.

My preference would be for "daily" powers to exist but to function like the Channel Divinity powers: you have a small pool of them, they refresh on a short rest, but you can only use one per encounter. Possibly have them cost a healing surge or an action point so players think twice about using...

4E did "Draw Maps But Leave Blank Spaces" and "Ask Them Questions Then Build Upon the Answers" before it was cool. 😏

4E skill challenges have been some of the best RPGing I've ever done. My players absolutely loved them, so much so that I would port them over to other systems we played (although they don't work quite as well as they do in 4E).

I have in the past referred to this as "playing 3E using 4E rules". I suspect its how a large number (perhaps even a majority?) of people experienced 4E, especially those that didn't bother to read the advice about encounter design and terrain features in the DMGs.

No lie. I'm not even posting in this thread and I was put on ignore too, apparently for just "liking" posts somebody disagreed with. Draw your own conclusions from that.

I've been running a 4E solo game with my 5 year old son and the house rule we've been using is you can use one big thing --- action point, daily, or item power --- per encounter but they all refresh with a short rest, similar to how Channel Divinity powers function. Its worked like a charm so...

And here's another discussion about 4E from a few years back that touches on some of the same points. https://adeptplay.com/seminar-hearts-minds/conversation-abomination-shall-indeed-be-named

For fuller context, it might be helpful to see some of the videos and discussions involving Ron's actual plays of 4E. His player handout in the introduction is particularly illuminating into how he sees the game. https://adeptplay.com/actual-play/barbaric-psychedelic-cosmic-cataclysmic-fore-ee...

Yup. Just wanted to clarify as a lot of posters are used to "empower the DM!" games where the only conversational constraint is Whatever The Lord God Dungeon Master Feels Like. 😉

Provided that what the GM says is constrained by the agenda and principles. In PbtA games the agenda and principles are just as much rules as the player-facing moves are.

Just to clarify, in 4E you also earned XP from skill challenges and quests and there was also a bit about XP for roleplaying "vignettes" in the DMG2. This wasn't an incidental amount, either: the XP from major quests and high-complexity SCs was just as much, if not more, as those awarded from...

Yes, but not all negotiation of fiction is GM Decides or Group Decides. Even these two systems alone are vastly different and produce profoundly different experiences at the table in regards to agency, distribution of authority, expectations of play, and so on. In this case, its more like...

That's still System Matters, though. You've just replaced a published system with an unpublished one. GM Decides or The Group Decides are absolutely systems (or at least components of a system).

For me, it was precisely the opposite. I had zero exposure to Story Now games before 4E and it was my experience with that system that led me to the PbtA family of games. In fact, my initial reaction to Dungeon World was essentially, "what's the big deal? This is exactly how 4E plays outside of...

Actuallly, techniques for soliciting feedback from players, including asking them pointed questions mid-play, is discussed in 4E's DMG2, pp. 16-19.

From what I have read here and there online, skill challenges were even more "storygame"-ish during playtest. Apparently if a player made a hard check they actually got to declare what happened as a result.