12th-level core-only smackdown

I liked the idea of Sabathius42's smackdown thread, but the 24-hour timeframe introduces lots of weird effects. I also thought it would be interesting to have a more realistic target.

So here's the setup (edited per Iku Rex's suggestions):

Build any 12th-level character using core materials only (PHB, DMG, MM1) and 28-point buy. You can buy the standard 88,000gp worth of gear, but no consumable items (potions, wands, etc.) are allowed. There's also a single, minor house rule: Anyone polymorphed into a hydra only gets a single bite attack -- the multiple brains are considered to be an (Ex) special quality.

You start out on a flat, featureless plain, 100' away from an adult brass dragon (CR12). You have five rounds to deal as much damage to it as possible (assume it has enough hp to live through all your attacks). After that, it uses its breath weapon once and then gets to make two rounds of full attacks against you. The final score is the amount of hp damage you inflicted minus the amount of damage you suffered in return (expected value, according to normal probabilities). Only damage you inflict during the initial five rounds counts, not any damage you might inflict while the dragon is making its return attacks. Also, only hp damage is counted, not other effects (even death effects).

Any buffs that you can keep up for at least 4 hours (possibly by using multiple spell slots) can be in place at the start of the fight. Anything else needs to be cast/activated during the five rounds.

Some more details about the dragon: In order to prevent too much specialization against the specific target, the creature has the same stats and abilities as an adult brass dragon, but it has no creature type, neutral alignment, no fire subtype (and no fire immunity or cold vulnerability), and it's not considered an arcane caster. Also, its breath weapon will be of a random energy type (fire, cold, lightning, acid) rather than just fire. You know the energy type as soon as the encounter starts (as if you had just seen what color dragon it is) but not beforehand.

The dragon is kind enough to stay on the ground and not use any of its spells or spell-like abilities, and you're unaffected by its frightful presence. You also don't have to worry about its attack of opportunity when closing with it.

Some stats for when you attack the dragon:
AC 27, touch AC 9, DR 5/magic, SR 20. Saves are Fort +15, Ref +11, Will +13.

When it attacks back:
Breath weapon 6d6 (reflex half, DC 23) -- random energy type, see above.
Full attack: Bite +24 (2d6+6), 2 claws +19 (1d8+3), 2 wings +19 (1d6+3), tail slap +19 (1d8+9).
Plus one more full attack as above.

Here's a build to start it off (edited for rule changes):

A 12th-level human cleric with the destruction domain. Initial stats Str 10, Dex 14, Con 10, Int 8, Wis 18, Cha 10. By L12, Wis is 21.

Gear is boots of speed (12k), periapt of wisdom +6 (36k), full plate +4 (17.65k), heavy shield (.02k), ring of protection +3 (18k), cloak of resistance +2 (4k).

Relevant feats: Spell penetration, greater spell penetration, spell focus (necromancy), greater spell focus (necromancy).

Buffs in effect before the fight: Magic Vestment on the shield.

During the fight:
Round 1: Use boots of speed to run 100' up to the dragon.
Rounds 2-5: Cast Harm. Attack bonus is +9 vs touch AC 9, so it will hit 95% of the time. The four 6th-level slots come from 2 (standard) + 1 (destruction domain) + 1 (high Wis).

Caster level 12 + 4 (greater spell penetration) vs. SR 20 = 85% chance of beating SR. A 6th-level spell with Wis 26 and greater spell focus (necromancy) gives a will save DC of 26, which the dragon will fail 60% of the time. So the total damage per round is 120 * .95 * .85 * (.6 * .5 + .4) = 67.83. Four rounds of that is 271 damage.

For the return attack: The cleric only has a Ref save of +8, so he fails the save vs. the breath weapon 70% of the time, and the average damage will be 6d6 * (.3 * .5 + .7) = 17.85.

The cleric's AC is 10 + 1 (dex) + 12 (armor) + 5 (shield) + 3 (deflection) + 1 (haste) = 32. So the dragon's full attack deals: 2d6+6 * .65 + (1d8+3 + 1d8+3 + 1d6+3 + 1d6+3 + 1d8+9) * .4 = 25.05.

So after the breath weapon and two full attacks, the cleric has taken 17.85 + 25.05 * 2 = 68 damage.

Final score is 271 - 68 = 203.

Hmm... after going through all that, this may require too much effort to get many responses. We'll see, though. I always enjoy working through this stuff. Maybe other people do, too.

Re: the rules
I think 8 hours is too long. You can easily get through a day's worth of adventuring in 2 hours in a typical "dungeon".

I'd have used a more generic target. (Same melee stats/saves/SR, no specific attributes like "chaotic" or "dragon" or "fire subtype".) A chaotic good dragon pretty much guarantees that every melee and ranged weapon will be dragonbane, and rangers are sure to get to use their favored enemy bonus. I'd also make the breath weapon generic, so you don't get the benefit of defensive magic unless you're protected from everything or cast the protection spell after spotting the enemy. Finally, I think giving the dragon true seeing is a little excessive. It's not a common ability for CR 12 monsters.

***
Anyway, I'll be posting a build or three later, using the rules from the OP. For one thing I intend to ruthlessly abuse the dragon's many (relatively) low damage attacks by putting up fire shield or empowered fire shield. (Ban now, or forever hold your peace. ) But for starters I think a basic ranger/fighter archer might provide a good basline for damage output.

Get a ranger with several greater arrows of slaying. At ~4000 gp each, there's enough there to almost certainly kill the dragon. Fort +15 vs DC 23 means it fails the save 35% o fthe time, passes 65% of the time. The probability that it survives 5 arrows in the first round is about 11%. Add 5 more arrows and it drops to about 1%. Instant kill in two rounds for about 40000 gp. I'd make the monster generic as IK pointed out - so that bane items and the like don't come into it.

Pinotage

Iku Rex said:

Re: the rules
I think 8 hours is too long. You can easily get through a day's worth of adventuring in 2 hours in a typical "dungeon".

I'd have used a more generic target. (Same melee stats/saves/SR, no specific attributes like "chaotic" or "dragon" or "fire subtype".) A chaotic good dragon pretty much guarantees that every melee and ranged weapon will be dragonbane, and rangers are sure to get to use their favored enemy bonus. I'd also make the breath weapon generic, so you don't get the benefit of defensive magic unless you're protected from everything or cast the protection spell after spotting the enemy. Finally, I think giving the dragon true seeing is a little excessive. It's not a common ability for CR 12 monsters.

***
Anyway, I'll be posting a build or three later, using the rules from the OP. For one thing I intend to ruthlessly abuse the dragon's many (relatively) low damage attacks by putting up fire shield or empowered fire shield. (Ban now, or forever hold your peace. ) But for starters I think a basic ranger/fighter archer might provide a good basline for damage output.

Click to expand...

Alright -- no other builds yet, so I'll go with most of your suggested changes. Specifically, making the creature more generic and dealing with the fire shield issue. I'll also reduce the required early buff duration to 4 hours -- 2 hours seems a little short. There are times when a 2-hour buff will last you through a whole day of encounters, but there are also plenty of times when you have to adventure in a dangerous area for far longer than that.

I put in True Seeing to foil some possible defensive techniques that a real dragon might deal with through intelligence. I suppose I can drop that, though, too. The dragon does have blindsense, so the worst it would end up with is a 50% miss chance.

The OP has been updated with those changes.

(I didn't have time to double check all the numbers, but it looks reasonable to me.)

Wild Elf Fighter 12
28 point buy

Str 14 (6)
Dex 17 (13)
Con 14 (6)
Int 8
Wis 11 (3)
Cha 8

+2 Dex -2 Int Wild Elf, +3 Dex from levels.
+2 Dex from item (see below)

Key stats are Dex 26 (+7) and Str 14 (+2)

Relevant feats: Weapon Focus (Longbow), Weapon Specialization (Longbow), Greater Weapon Focus (Longbow), Greater Weapon Specialization (Longbow), Improved Critical (Longbow), Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, Lightening Reflexes, Dodge

10250 +3 Mithral Chain Shirt
9180 +1 Animated Heavy Shield
4000 Gloves of Dexterity +2
2000 Amulet of Natural Armor +1
8000 Ring of Protection +2
12000 Boots of Speed
4000 Cloak of Resistance +2
5000 Dusty Rose Ioun Stone (+1 AC)
25600 Oathbow
5000 Lesser Bracers of Archery
1000 Cloak of Resistance +1

86030
1970 Left

Attack bonus, activated oathbow, hasted, Rapid Shot: +12 BAB - 2 Rapid Shot + 1 haste + 7 Dex + 1 bracers + 2 GWF + 5 bow = +26/+26/+26/+21/+16

Damage:
1d8 + 2 Str + 5 bow + 2d6 bow + 4 GWS = 1d8 + 11 + 2d6, 19-20/4x

1st three attacks it on anything but a natural 1
4th attack hits on 6 or more (75% of the time)
5th attack hits on 11 or more (50% of the time)

+300% crits 10% of the time = *1,3 damage (not including damage dice)

1 round: 3*0,95*(2d6+(1,3*(1d8+11))+0,75*(4d6+(1,2*(1d8+15))+0,50*(4d6+(1,2*(1d8+15))= 77,4 + 20,4 + 13,6 = 111,4
5 rounds: 556,9 damage

Reflex save: 4 (fighter) + 7 Dex + 2 Lightening Reflexes + 1 cloak = +14
Makes DC 23 save on 9 or better, fails on 8 or lower (60%/40%).
21*0,40 + 10*0,60= -14,4 damage from breath weapon.

AC: 10 + 6 Dex (max armor) + 7 armor + 3 shield + 1 natural armor + 2 deflection + 1 insight + 1 haste + 1 dodge = 32

+24 hits on 8 or better, +19 hits on 13 or better

(2d6+6)*1,05*0,65 + (1d8+3 + 1d8+3 + 1d6+3 + 1d6+3 + 1d8+9)*1,05*0,40 =
13,65*0,65 + 43,575*0,40 = 26,3
(Bolded numbers will be the same for everyone without DR. *1,05 is the dragon's critical hits.)

2 rounds: - 52,6 damage from full attack

Total score: 556,9-14,4-52,6= 489,9


I'll probably post a spellcaster build tomorrow or the day after.

Does anything prevent a contestant from teleporting away after five rounds?

-Stuart

Re: teleporting

I think teleporting away would be contrary to the spirit (and letter) of the rules in the OP.

Just as the dragon stands around doing nothing for 5 rounds (testing offense), the PC stands around doing nothing for two/three rounds (testing defense) when the dragon attacks.

szilard said:

Does anything prevent a contestant from teleporting away after five rounds?

Click to expand...

I was intentionally nonspecific about how the dragon gets in position to attack back. The dragon simply gets his breath weapon and attacks, regardless of where the character is at the time. Thematically, this would represent the dragon getting in some attacks during the initial five rounds, but it's easier to describe the setup and work out the results if things happen consecutively.