Do we coddle new Players?

Reading the thread here about the group of new Players who are (at least one is) afraid of their characters dying, make me wonder: Are we coddling new Players?

When I started D&D, back in 1980, with the Basic set, we had PCs die by the handful. My very first adventure (In Search of the Unknown), we had one PC die in the very first battle, in the first hallway, against some berserkers. We had another PC die in the second fight against some giant rats. The surviving PCs left the dungeon and regrouped with the new PCs. Then we went back in.

Playing and DMing Keep on the Borderlands, I saw a dozen PCs die. Hell, we had a TPK when we took on the ogre as our first encounter in the Caves of Chaos.

All through the first couple years of playing, PCs died. Not as often or many as in the first months with this game, but sometimes. And this was all at low levels, before anyone even considered raise dead as an option. When the PC died, we made up another one almost immediately.

We didn't fret over PC deaths. It was a game first, and our emotional attachment to our characters was no more than our attachment to characters on a game board. Sure, we had names and personalities for our characters. And through game play we had backgrounds. So the PCs were not just cardboard figures. But they weren't "my precious" either.

Would new Players, now adays, be well served by going through a low-level meat-grinder dungeon, just to get over the shock of PC death? Let a new Player see characters die off a few times in an introductory dungeon crawl adventure before actually starting a "real" campaign?

Do you see a difference in emotional attachment between a Player with a 10th-level character that is also their first and only character, versus a Player with a 10th-level character that is the 5th character they've played (having gone through the death of the previous 4 at low level)?

Quasqueton

I've cuddled new players a few times, but for some odd reason they never came back to the game. . .

I suppose there are a number of elements:
1. Video games and characters having multiple lives - so getting killed is not the end

2. The ease of character creation in earlier editions (so far less work getting there)

3. A greater emphasis on the amateur dramatics rather than killing monsters and taking their stuff from the early days.

Also, is there a difference in emotional attachment by Players depending on their age?

Quasqueton

Why am I hearing the voice of Grandpa Simpson when I read this?

I really think that this may have more to do with age than playstyle. Back in the 80's how old were you? I was 11 in 1981 (when I started playing) and had PCs die left and right. One died before I had a name for him. There was no roleplaying per say and characters were disposable fun.

Today it's a little different. I make up backgrounds, allies, enemies etc all before i sit at the table with a new character. Something I would never even have thought of back in '81.

I would say that if anything some of the gaming community is hostile to new players. At least that is my experience here. There are a few gaming clubs in town and even me, an experienced gamer, had a very hard time trying to join up with them (this is after they were advertising for players - I am not your greasy smelly gamer type but when I met them that was obviously what they were looking for ). I shudder to think how they would have treated a new player or a female one.

As far as coddling new players though? I can't see it as a problem even if it were widespread. New players mean the continuation of our hobby and if that means that those who have access to new players have to let them live for a few levels then that is Ok with me.

Quasqueton said:

Would new Players, now adays, be well served by going through a low-level meat-grinder dungeon, just to get over the shock of PC death?

Click to expand...

No.

Because that question is tantamount to asking: would new players be well served by playing the game the way I enjoy playing it?

In some games, PC's never die a permanent death. It isn't the way I play, but I do recognize its a perfectly valid style.

It would be more meaningful to discuss the implications, benefits, and problems inherent in a game style where PC's can and do die on a regular basis.

Are we coddling new Players? "Coddle" is such a biased word...

Back in the the Old Days, the biggest difference between Fighters was the percentage-roll on his 18 Strength. If your Fighter died, simply re-roll the percentage, change the name from Zunk to Klunk, and you're ready to continue.

In 3.5E players customize their characters, and that obliges the player to anticipate what they want their character to achieve 5 or 10 levels down the road (feats-chains, skills, prestiges classes, etc.). I think that means a greater emotional investment, right out the gate.

So, yeh, if players are wanting their highly-customized PCs to stay alive for at least 10 levels, and DMs are being sensitive to that, then I suppose there's been a DM-engineered change in the PC mortality rate.



Tony M

I sympathize with Quasqueton's feeling on this - but in my case, I have a hesitancy to kill off PCs, probably more than I should, because of the time it takes to invest in one in 3E, nowadays. I don't mind it, personally, and wouldn't mind if a character got permanently killed off, because it doesn't take that long to me, and I have so many different character ideas brimming around in my head that I can't play long enough to play through them all! (I GM far more than I play.)

I'm tempted at some point (WAAAY late this year - I'm actually getting to play again now!) to convince the group to do 2 or 3 sessions of old-school dungeoneering, with 1st level PC's, a death-dealing dungeon (like keep on the borderlands, or horror on the hill), and just burn through PC's until we finish. Maybe use Castles and Crusades as the rules, because it's much quicker to create PCs. It's kinda like getting over your fear of spiders by keeping one as a pet, I guess.

I/We don't. Had a total party kill to end 2004. 3/5 players are newbies. They took it hard.
The experienced players are laying back a bit and letting the newbs learn about D&D and all of it's trappings the old-fashioned way: by rolling up lots of characters. Hell, one of the news is my wife, and she didn't even make me sleep on the couch after her first char's death.

I think you do have to look at the age factor, and you have to look at gaming emphasis. If you are looking to get new players to get into a character, develop a personality, and roleplay well, running them through a meat-grinder adventure would probably discourage them. If you play a more hack-n-slash style game which emphasizes game mechanics, it probably wouldn't be so bad.

On the other side, it is important to make players understand that death is a possibility and that it is just part of the game, not personal.