Massive Open Content SRD

In another thread, d-minky said:

This makes me wonder -- since the SRD is open content and therefore can be made into a website, or a pdf, or searchable help file, or whatever you want... has anyone begun to collect open material from other sources besides WotC and done the same?

Sort of like a massive open content SRD? Or separate files that index open content from each company (i.e. "WotC Open Content," "Green Ronin Open Content," "FFG Open Content," etc.)...

I've seen numerous projects translating the SRD into as many different formats as possible so anybody can use it with whatever program they want; but has anyone considered doing this with other company's open content as well? (I'm assuming that would be legal... correct me if I'm wrong.)

That would be a really cool idea, IMHO, and could even help sell these companies' books -- if you include the source book in each open content piece, people could browse through these rules and if they see something they like, they might be inclined to purchase the book it is from.

Just a thought...

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I've seen several such suggestions fall flat. The main objection, and why I think they ultimately fail, is that no one wants to hurt the publishers. Another reason is that someone inevitably comes up and says "that product? Oh, I have the extract and will be posting it in no time. Really!" Sometimes even with "just so you'll see, here is the first chapter." For some reason, the full extract never gets posted.

I think it can work, and I think it can make for an excellent resource. Here is how I will go about doing it:
* Set up a private group/forum. All discussion and posting will be private only.
* Agree on a "Declaration of Intent", such as "Our purpose is to release OGC extracts to make all open rules available to the public, not to harm the publishers or make their products obsolete. We believe that by extracting only the rules and making them easily accessible the campaigns of individual GMs and the products produced by the industry as a whole will be enhanced."
* Agree on "Principles of Action". I am thinking of something like
a) Only products over a year old will be extracted.
b) This is a volunteer project. No one can tell anyone else to do a certain project, but if someone volunteers to help someone they ought to work with him and allow him to coordinate the efforts of the different volunteers.
b) When in doubt, the least inclusive interpertation of the OGL will be applied.
c) The publisher will be contacted at the project's beginning and its end. He will be asked if he wants us to extract all the OGC or rules only, if he wants to receive the extract prior to publication and if so if he wants to approve it, if he wants to be credited and if so how, if he wants to allow/add a new OGC/PI declaration (we can work with both), and if he has any reservations/concerns.
* Agree on projects, headed by Project Coordinators. All projects are to be maintained on private group/forum, posting all extracts and conducting communications through there.
* A Global Coordinator must be appointed, that will be able to appoint new project coordinators or function as one temporarily if current ones are inactive or need aid.

I think such a system can work, and useful extracts can be made fairly quickly. It is my experience that a few dedicated persons can do much in a short time, but if a project lingers it will not be completed as interest falls.

Just because it would be legal doesn't mean it would be nice.

Although it would seem fine for OOP products. But with PDF publishing, there's no such things as "OOP".

The problem is, the OGC is several of these books is crippled (want to make a "Sword & Sorcery Monsters" SRD file from the Creature Collections? You'll have to give them all new names, because while the statblock for the Spider-Eye Goblin is OGC, the name "Spider-Eye Goblin" is not and you would not be allowed to use it). Or sometimes the designations of Product Identity and Open Content are so confusing you'd want a couple of lawyers by your side. (Monte Cook's products suffer from this.)

Gez said:

Just because it would be legal doesn't mean it would be nice.

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I agree. But just because it isn't nice doesn't mean it isn't good, in this case I think publishing OGC can benefit the whole a lot more than not, overall.

Although it would seem fine for OOP products. But with PDF publishing, there's no such things as "OOP".

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Almost any product is pdf, or can be made into one. That's why I am promoting extracting only the rules content. Supposedly, the person using it would like the fluff and graphics that go along with it. If he doesn't, maybe he shouldn't be forced to buy it?

The problem is, the OGC is several of these books is crippled (want to make a "Sword & Sorcery Monsters" SRD file from the Creature Collections? You'll have to give them all new names, because while the statblock for the Spider-Eye Goblin is OGC, the name "Spider-Eye Goblin" is not and you would not be allowed to use it).

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That's a good reason to HAVE an SRD extract. It is a laundary for crippled OGC: the same OGC, only with names you can use!
Indeed, I suggest this as a principle: the more crippled and obtuse the OGC declaration, the more is an OGC extract needed.

Or sometimes the designations of Product Identity and Open Content are so confusing you'd want a couple of lawyers by your side. (Monte Cook's products suffer from this.)

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That is a more serious concern. I think that by limiting ourselves to strict interpertations of the OGL we can avoid much of this issue, and still be left with lots of OGC from most products. In some cases, however, it may indeed by impossible to publish without a lawyer.
As a side note, if I were to get sued in this case I would claim the work was apparently not published under the OGL at all, as OGC was not clearly denoted as required by the OGL... after all, you need a lawyer to tell you what it OGC

The other major point is that it'll be tough to identify any open content. You can't say "Blue Rose Magic Rules", for instance, because you can't use the words "Blue Rose".

arscott said:

The other major point is that it'll be tough to identify any open content. You can't say "Blue Rose Magic Rules", for instance, because you can't use the words "Blue Rose".

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True. I wonder if "BR Magic Rules" would be a violation of copyright? Or "Indigo Fuschia"?

Gez said:

The problem is, the OGC is several of these books is crippled (want to make a "Sword & Sorcery Monsters" SRD file from the Creature Collections? You'll have to give them all new names, because while the statblock for the Spider-Eye Goblin is OGC, the name "Spider-Eye Goblin" is not and you would not be allowed to use it).

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I'm not sure if it was the Creature Collection or Relics & Rituals, but I'm pretty sure one of them declared all names as PI, and added a little blurb that said "You are hereby granted to use these names for the sole purpose of using these monsters/spells/whatever." So you could use the spell "Chardun's Charnel House of Nastiness", but you couldn't use the name Chardun for something else.

*rolls eyes*
Geez here we go again, people are working on it. But as it involves a lot of time consuming activities that are done for free, so they are usually put on the backburner when something else comes up or people are just tired of looking at more text that needs to be OCRed and proofread, layout, etc.

I for one was/am bussy with:
- Laying out the SRD into a nice document (half way through).
- Scan/OCR/layout of Unearthed Arcana OGC (Scan and OCR is done, just needs proof reading again as i missed something BIG the last time i posted a part of it).
- Scan/OCR/layout Spycraft OGC (Scan done, half way through OCR).
- Scan/OCR/layout Factory OGC by Perpetrated Press (Scan done, half way through OCR).
- Scan/OCR/layout Fields of Blood OGC (was done scanning and half way through OCR when DTRPG released it as digital download, so now it's on the backburner).
- Scan/OCR/layout The Book of the Righteous OGC (OCR done, 90% done with OCR and done some layout, still working to upgrade it to 3.5).
- Bits and pieces of OGC to fill up the SRD so it can be used as a full game
- Generic OGC fantasy setting (already got a map made by crabclaw, but not much more at the moment).
- Design of spell and monster cards.
- Website that will host all of the above.

A year ago i was ready to launch a 'simple' website that hosted part of this OGC material, but due all sorts of circumstances i didn't. Now i'm bussy with redesigning my webshop (with a new CMS), after that i either plug in some additional components into the cms that's running my webshop or i'll use the same CMS to start another website. The reason i'll not host them with someone else or host them halfassed is because i have certain ideas that won't work properly if it's executed halfassed (better late and good then early and bad).

No one wants to hurt the publishers, especially when they make great OGC declarations. Take Mousferatu's The Iconic Bestiary, it's all OGC and real easy to just copy paste and redo layout, but that will hurt Mouseferatu in sales. So what i do instead is look first at what i've got left on my plate at this moment and start there...

Also, if at all possible try to get someone else to proofread the OGC, if you miss something like... Oh, for example... Star Wars. Then it would be nice if it got caught before you posted it in a public forum...

The problem with this is that OGC is not for public consumption. It is so that publishers can take others' rules and other cool bits and use/alter them for their own books.

I would love to see an expanded SRD*, but for print it may take 18-36 months before sales of that book make it worthwhile for the publisher to release the OGC to the XSRD and by then those publishers and consumer who really wanted it will have it.

*More for the publishers than the consumers.

Any massive undertaking such as this will hurt publishers and burnout those involved. Not to mention the possibility of significant mistakes seeping into the final work -- it's not hard to properly identify OGC in most products but people still get it wrong quite frequently.