Hide Skill and Hide in Plain Sight

Aluvial · May 5, 2005

I have a 10th level thief, with 9 levels of Shadowdancer. His hide score is normally a +35 with all enhancements, etc....

Recentely in a battle, he flew up midair and stole something from one of his opponents without the opponent noticing.

The reason he could do so was because there was concealment in the form of smoke (that limited vision to 60'). He managed to do this twice without being spotted.

Then when the opponent, still unknowing that there was anyone near him, moving away provoked an AoO. The thief, attacking from hiding, got a sneak attack and remained hiding!!!!! The attack was with a -20 to the hide check as per the rules.

The opponent's spot is only a +6....

Does this sound correct to you, did I miss something?
Can he do this while Spring Attacking (while flying)??

Aluvial

Demoquin · May 5, 2005

No i dont think he could do that while flying ... i think there is a feat for an aerial spring attack. Well a shadowdancers main roll is to remain hidden .. so he is doing something right and i wouldnt worry about it. Maybe up the spot on a few (elite) guards, to try and notice something fishy.

Abraxas · May 5, 2005

Recentely in a battle, he flew up midair and stole something from one of his opponents without the opponent noticing.

Does your character also have a really high Sleight of Hand - otherwise the target may have noticed the item being taken.

Then when the opponent, still unknowing that there was anyone near him, moving away provoked an AoO. The thief, attacking from hiding, got a sneak attack and remained hiding!!!!! The attack was with a -20 to the hide check as per the rules.

Well, if there was smoke providing concealment the attack wouldn't be a sneak attack. If the smoke wasn't thick enough within 60-ft to provide concealment and your character and the target are in midair, where was the shadow "within 10-ft" that allowed the character to use the HiPS ability. If there wasn't one - the character wasn't hiding in plain sight.

Otherwise, yes, a shadowdancer could use HiPS, take the -20 penalty and attack and remain hidden.

Can he do this while Spring Attacking (while flying)??

While Spring Attacking? Yes.
While Spring Attacking While Flying - debatable, I'm pretty sure there was a thread discussing if a character can or can't use the Spring Attack feat while flying.

Hypersmurf · May 5, 2005

Abraxas said:
While Spring Attacking While Flying - debatable, I'm pretty sure there was a thread discussing if a character can or can't use the Spring Attack feat while flying.

There's nothing wrong with it.

Spring Attack doesn't put any restriction on the form of movement you take before and after your attack.

-Hyp.

Abraxas · May 5, 2005

I agree, but I was pretty sure there was something awhile back around here because of the "fancy footwork" line (or maybe that was tumbling while flying) Oh well

Aluvial · May 5, 2005

Yeah, his Sleight of Hand is impressive. My thought was that since the smoke is giving concealment (and a miss chance) than he can hide in it.

My problem comes in when he tries to do this in the future... he has to have something to hide behind regardless. Do you think he can hide behind his victim? He's small, and tends to reduce himself sometimes... This reduces the damage he can deliver, but do you think he can still somehow sneak up, get behind a target and remain hidden, in his target's shadow???

High level is giving me a headache.

Oh, I'd let a guy tumble while flying... why not? No better place to tumble in fact. There's no ground to contend with, and Tumble is just a nice way of saying twisting/rolling/turning/leaping around your opponent.

Shadows are hard to judge...

Aluvial

mikebr99 · May 5, 2005

Aluvial said:
My problem comes in when he tries to do this in the future... he has to have something to hide behind regardless. Do you think he can hide behind his victim? He's small, and tends to reduce himself sometimes... This reduces the damage he can deliver, but do you think he can still somehow sneak up, get behind a target and remain hidden, in his target's shadow???

Aluvial

There are no facing rules in 3.5... we have no backs.

Mike

Aluvial · May 5, 2005

mikebr99 said:
There are no facing rules in 3.5... we have no backs.

Do we still cast shadows? And if we do, can't the thief with Hide in Plain Sight hide right in it, even at 5' away?

mikebr99 · May 5, 2005

Aluvial said:
Do we still cast shadows? And if we do, can't the thief with Hide in Plain Sight hide right in it, even at 5' away?

Well... that really depends on your DM's requirement on the amount (area) of shadow required to power the HiPS ability... I'd say no... at high noon, but maybe, closer to dusk, with the target being at least 1 size cat. bigger then the Rogue. YMMV

Mike

MoonZar · May 5, 2005

Aluvial said:
I have a 10th level thief, with 9 levels of Shadowdancer. His hide score is normally a +35 with all enhancements, etc....

Recentely in a battle, he flew up midair and stole something from one of his opponents without the opponent noticing.

The reason he could do so was because there was concealment in the form of smoke (that limited vision to 60'). He managed to do this twice without being spotted.

Then when the opponent, still unknowing that there was anyone near him, moving away provoked an AoO. The thief, attacking from hiding, got a sneak attack and remained hiding!!!!! The attack was with a -20 to the hide check as per the rules.

The opponent's spot is only a +6....

Does this sound correct to you, did I miss something?
Can he do this while Spring Attacking (while flying)??

Aluvial

Well even if he don't spot the shadow dancer, personnaly i would allow the guy to move and swing his sword in the direction where he was stabed and apply the rules when you attack someone invisible.

Anyway the shadowdancer is level 19 he should be able to do thing unhuman or illogical.

Spring attack dont say anything about the character could not do it while flying, it allow the character to move attack and move again, so why not while flying or swimming !

Hide Skill and Hide in Plain Sight

Aluvial

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Demoquin

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Abraxas

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Hypersmurf

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Abraxas

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Aluvial

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mikebr99

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Aluvial

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mikebr99

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MoonZar

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