Why does magic work the way it works?

Quasqueton

First Post
In the D&D game world...

Is creating a new spell an act as simple as just "researching" it? If so, why aren't there spells for every little imaginable situation? If not, what does it take to create a new spell?

Why is there no iceball, lightningball, sonicball, or acidball spell? (Like fireball.)

Why isn't there a 1st-level "no-save, just die" spell?

Why are some spells only divine, or only arcane, while some are both?

Why are some spells different levels depending on being divine or arcane?

Why is the list of summonable monsters not mirror images (celestial X and fiendish X)?

Why does magic in your D&D game world work the way it is described in the rule books?

Quasqueton
 

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Because spells aren't created. They're found. Spells are pre-existing "knots" in the magic field and the proper formula can "untie" those knots. Really talented or highly-trained practitioners can modify the outcome in some ways (metamagic) but primarily the spell is the way it is. Wizards find these "knots" during spell preparation and hang them on their own personal power framework for later use, while sorcerers simply summon the ones they are naturally attuned to as needed.
 

Because that is the way the game is written. It works for what I want and that's all I need it to do. Also balance and space llimitations.
 

Overall, I think the issue you're having is you want the D&D magic system to have a higher degree of internal consistency than it has. D&D magic wasn't designed with a blueprint from the start...it's more like a huge house that was built one room at a time, often by different builders, often with little regard for how one room looks compared to the rooms next to it.

3E / 3.5 does take some significant steps towards creating a common framework for magic...standardized range types, duration types, etc. But, they didn't tear down the system and rebuild it from scratch, which is why you still have the crazy-quilt nature of the thing.

To be fair, you could argue that it is a nice representation of a system of magic in which various wizards and clerics, working independently, came up with the various spells.

Quasqueton said:
Is creating a new spell an act as simple as just "researching" it? If so, why aren't there spells for every little imaginable situation? If not, what does it take to create a new spell?

In theory, there could be. But, remember, researching a 1st level spell costs 1000gp. How many wizards are willing to spend their money on a spell that'd "perfectly fit" a situation, when there's already a spell that comes close.

Quasqueton said:
Why is there no iceball, lightningball, sonicball, or acidball spell? (Like fireball.)

The RL reason is because many of the spells (esp. the "legacy" spells from prior editions) were written as one-off, ad-hoc spells. No one sat down and said, "there should be a third-level attack spell for each of the five energy types." For that matter, they weren't treated as five "comparable" energy types until 3E.

That said...
- 3E / 3.5 starts to move towards this, with the "comparable" Lesser Orb / Orb spells (one for each energy type)
- With the Energy Substitution metamagic feat (which does not increase the level of the spell in question), you could have an Iceball, Lightningball, Sonicball, or Acidball.

Quasqueton said:
Why isn't there a 1st-level "no-save, just die" spell?

There is one. Magic Missile...if your HPs aren't very high. No save, no attack roll.

With the exception of Magic Missile, most attack spells either (a) require an attack roll, or (b) allow a saving throw. Those that don't tend to be higher-level spells, and usually affect a limited number of HPs worth of creature (e.g., Power Word Kill).

Quasqueton said:
Why are some spells only divine, or only arcane, while some are both?

Arbitrary decisions on the part of the game designers that some spells are the province of one or the other.

Some of these make sense (i.e., healing is a divine spell...though there's an exception in that bards can heal, and it's an arcane spell for them). Some don't (i.e., why can't a wizard cast Blade Barrier?)

Again, a big part of the reason is the nature of the "legacy" spells...Blade Barrier was always a cleric spell, so it still is.

Quasqueton said:
Why are some spells different levels depending on being divine or arcane?

In theory, maybe because the designers decided that a particular effect would be more "natural" or "easier" for a particular class. More likely, an arbitrary decision, based on relative power level for the spell in question on that class's spell list.

Quasqueton said:
Why is the list of summonable monsters not mirror images (celestial X and fiendish X)?

Probably purely arbitrary.
 
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Quasqueton said:
In the D&D game world...

(snip)

Why isn't there a 1st-level "no-save, just die" spell?

If you're talking about the "game world," (opposed to the game mechanics) there's no such concept as "1st level."
 

My reasonings for the below.

Quasqueton said:
Is creating a new spell an act as simple as just "researching" it? If so, why aren't there spells for every little imaginable situation? If not, what does it take to create a new spell?
[/QUOTE]

I don't remember. I do know that beforehand, creating a new spell was a very, very timeconsuming expeience and also extremely expensive. ie, a way to soak up so much time and cash so that very few players would ever bother with it so the status quo could remain intact. The SRD just says 'it's possible' but as far as I know that's all up to the GM. I can't remember ever seeing any rules on it, but then it's never something I've had to deal with.

Why is there no iceball, lightningball, sonicball, or acidball spell? (Like fireball.)

You could use the 'Energy Substitution' feat from Tome and Blood to do that. Otherwise, probably space considerations since they'd all work just about the same.

Why isn't there a 1st-level "no-save, just die" spell?

Because that would be stupid. And because first level spells are suppossed to be very weak.

Why are some spells only divine, or only arcane, while some are both?

Because it's easier to have them listed together. They used to be duplicated on either side of the arcane/divine barrier and some actually had some different effects. I'd assume in the game world, because some spells are going to be more commonly duplicated than others. Wizards would see a cleric casting Hold Person and think 'I gotta get me some of that', and so researched it.

Why are some spells different levels depending on being divine or arcane?

Some things are easier for the gods to do, some harder. Usually the easier ones are the ones that fit the cleric mode of 'protect, defend, or buff'; that fits the cleric role better, so they are lower level. Like how Illusionists used to get illusion spells at lower levels than general mages, or how now you can cast a spell from your specialty. Those spells fall withint the broader arcane/divine specializations.

Why is the list of summonable monsters not mirror images (celestial X and fiendish X)?

I have no idea.

Why does magic in your D&D game world work the way it is described in the rule books?

Because it's just simpler to do it that way. Re-doing the D&D magic system to something that makes even basic logical sense instead of a cobbled-together mass of 'spells useful only to people who go out and kill things for a living' would be such a massive undertaking that would then have to be rebalanced with all the other aspects that would have to be changed or reconsidered so that someone couldn't come up with an unbeatable 'nuclear weapon' combination that it's just not worth it. I don't have the time or the design sense to come up with something like that. If I wanted such a thing badly enough, I'd just play another system.

OTOH, 'basic logical sense' to me would also mean that there would be a lot - I mean, a lot - of spells that no-one would ever use 'in game'. Things like 'bless crops' or 'midwife' or 'mass continental climate control' would, in any sort of realistic approach to a fantasy world, far outweigh things like 'Spider Climb' and 'enlarge'. You don't need things like that for the basic, cnematic, high-action sword-and-sorcery type adventures that are the meat and potatoes of D&D. The fact that the spell lists as they are serve that basic premise is pretty much all the answer you need.
 

hexgrid said:
If you're talking about the "game world," (opposed to the game mechanics) there's no such concept as "1st level."

Sure there is. Spellcasters know trhey can cast spells of different abilities and they have to gain power to master the higher ones. They might not refer to them as first level, but the concept has to be there.
 

Because that would be stupid. And because first level spells are suppossed to be very weak.

Um, I think he's asking for an in-mileu reason.

For me, it's enough to say that it's more difficult to kill someone with asurity than to hurt them.


The one that I find logically elusive is why natural cure time is relatively static with level, but the same cure spell is less and less effective at healing you as you advance.
 

WayneLigon said:
The SRD just says 'it's possible' but as far as I know that's all up to the GM. I can't remember ever seeing any rules on it, but then it's never something I've had to deal with.

There are, indeed, rules for it in the DMG. It's not cheap (1000gp per spell level, plus some money for initial set-up of a research lab, and, IIRC, 1 week per spell level), but it's not horrid.

I've had a few players over the years who were really into researching their own spells, but they've been the exceptions to the rule. And, even then, the spells they've researched have often been variants on existing spells, rather than spells created out of whole cloth.
 

Quasqueton said:
Is creating a new spell an act as simple as just "researching" it? If so, why aren't there spells for every little imaginable situation? If not, what does it take to create a new spell?

This one is easy:

It takes time.

It takes money.

and there is no "Internet"

(and if there were, there would be lawyers with spell-copyright laws working to break down the spell-distribution networks. :) )
 

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