Campaign Conundrum 1 - Silence

Archade · Jul 8, 2005

Hi all!

I've been having a recurring problem with my ingenious players, and I'd really like some feedback. They've taken to using the silence spell aggressively, which I'm fine with, but some of their tactics have caused contention.

1) They want to cast silence on an arrow and shoot a critter. Should that be transferrable? I think yes.

2) They want to cast silence on an arrow and shoot an object (table, wall, etc). I would think that if the enchanted arrow shatters/breaks, the silence spell ends, so I've been ruling that there's a 25% chance the spell ends when they shoot the object. Is that fair?

3) Sometimes they want to shoot a specific square, and stick an arrow in the turf. Shooting a flat surface 100' away should be harder than AC 9 I would think. Am I right?

Thanks!

Infiniti2000 · Jul 8, 2005

1. When an arrow hits, it breaks. The silence spell IMO should then be destroyed along with the object it was cast on. A similar problem occurs with casting silence on water. Note also that nothing says that the arrow should be stuck in the critter. Next time, just say that it's a glancing blow and bounces back into the middle of the party.

2. Agreed, see #1. I'd say it's a 100% chance the spell ends when the object breaks.

3. This is not an easy call. There's no really good rule for targeting a square like that. Hopefully others will respond. I think AC9 is a little too high, but I see nothing wrong with this tactic at all. If the ground is soft (like an archery target), then the arrow shouldn't break.

reveal · Jul 8, 2005

Archade said:
1) They want to cast silence on an arrow and shoot a critter. Should that be transferrable? I think yes.

1) Yes, it would follow the arrow. But when an arrow hits a target, it breaks thereby disrupting the spell.

2) They want to cast silence on an arrow and shoot an object (table, wall, etc). I would think that if the enchanted arrow shatters/breaks, the silence spell ends, so I've been ruling that there's a 25% chance the spell ends when they shoot the object. Is that fair?

2) There is a 50% chance of retrieving arrows if you shoot at a target and miss. 50% of the arrows you find will still be usable while the other 50% will not. Just like my first answer, when an arrow is in the "50% not usable" category, the spell is disrupted.

3) Sometimes they want to shoot a specific square, and stick an arrow in the turf. Shooting a flat surface 100' away should be harder than AC 9 I would think. Am I right?

3) Why should the AC of the group go up just because it's 100' away if a creature standing in the same square would have their normal AC? I would use the splash weapon rules, which state that the AC of the ground they are targetting is 5. If it hits, I would then refer to point 2 above.

Archade · Jul 8, 2005

The reason I'd make the ground AC9 is this ... targeting a square is normally AC 5, but with an arrow or crossbow shooting strait to hit a flat surface far away, I'd give the +4 AC granted to prone targets.

reveal · Jul 8, 2005

Archade said:
The reason I'd make the ground AC9 is this ... targeting a square is normally AC 5, but with an arrow or crossbow shooting strait to hit a flat surface far away, I'd give the +4 AC granted to prone targets.

But the ground isn't prone. It's not moving around, it's just sitting there. Both thrown weapons (splash weapons per se) and shot weapons (arrows, bolts, slings) are all ranged attacks. Why should the shot weapon suffer when it comes to hitting a flat, non-moving object? Plus prone people only suffer a -4 to AC against melee attacks.

Scion · Jul 8, 2005

While I dont know if the breaking arrow disrupting the spell or not is by the RAW (any rules quotes here?) it would be easy enough to get around by tacking something onto the arrow that you cast the spell on instead, so that doesnt stop the issue.

I have found that changing the spell to be like an area of deafness instead tends to balance the spell out pretty well (generally I make it 20% chance of losing a spell being cast and +20 to any checks to try to do things quiety).

silence is just a nasty spell really, have to be careful with it.

Infiniti2000 · Jul 8, 2005

reveal said:
Plus prone people only suffer a -4 to AC against melee attacks.

Right, which is why he's giving a +4 AC to ranged attacks. I'm guessing you just made a typo ... or something.

reveal · Jul 8, 2005

Scion said:
While I dont know if the breaking arrow disrupting the spell or not is by the RAW (any rules quotes here?) it would be easy enough to get around by tacking something onto the arrow that you cast the spell on instead, so that doesnt stop the issue.

I have found that changing the spell to be like an area of deafness instead tends to balance the spell out pretty well (generally I make it 20% chance of losing a spell being cast and +20 to any checks to try to do things quiety).

silence is just a nasty spell really, have to be careful with it.

From the SRD:

An arrow that hits its target is destroyed; one that misses has a 50% chance of being destroyed or lost.

I would say that if the arrow is destroyed, it's no longer able to properly store the spell any longer.

reveal · Jul 8, 2005

Infiniti2000 said:
Right, which is why he's giving a +4 AC to ranged attacks. I'm guessing you just made a typo ... or something.

Not a typo. Prone creatures do not gain a bonus to AC from ranged attacks. They only lose AC against melee attacks.

Scion · Jul 8, 2005

reveal said:
I would say that if the arrow is destroyed, it's no longer able to properly store the spell any longer.

I realize that the arrow is destroyed, that has nothing to do with what I asked however

Can you, or anyone else, find a rule that says that the spell will go away when the arrow breaks?

An enchanted magical item loses its power when broken, but we are talking about a spell cast on something here, not a magical item.

Again however, someone could cast silence on a thumb tack, put it on the arrow and fire the arrow and the result would be the same: Area of silence around where the arrow hit.

Campaign Conundrum 1 - Silence

Archade

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reveal

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