Shamans?

I am currently desiging a part of my campaign in which Shamanism, or atleast proto-druidic magic (with a shamanistic feel) is desired. I am aware of atleast two 2E shaman classes/kits, as well as Shadowrun shamanism, but what I want to know is:
1) Has anyone designed a Shaman core class/variant on Druid?
2) What are the 3E "cannon" (i.e. book/sourcebook/d20 book) attempts at such a class?

Thanks in advance...
 

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Shades of Green said:
I am currently desiging a part of my campaign in which Shamanism, or atleast proto-druidic magic (with a shamanistic feel) is desired. I am aware of atleast two 2E shaman classes/kits, as well as Shadowrun shamanism, but what I want to know is:
1) Has anyone designed a Shaman core class/variant on Druid?
2) What are the 3E "cannon" (i.e. book/sourcebook/d20 book) attempts at such a class?

Thanks in advance...
1. Check the sticky near the top of this particular forum, and wizards.com's boards under the Classes (or it might be Classes & Races) forum - there's a sticky there too (Core Class Compendium). As well, google might turn up a few. Even going through the pages of this forum might bring up something (?).

2. Spirit Shaman (in Complete Divine) - 3.5, and Shaman (in Oriental Adventures) - 3.0. That's for WotC. Past that, many more probably. . .


edit --- . . . notably, the Shaman's Handbook (by Green Ronin).
 
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Aus_Snow said:
1. Check the sticky near the top of this particular forum, and wizards.com's boards under the Classes (or it might be Classes & Races) forum - there's a sticky there too (Core Class Compendium). As well, google might turn up a few. Even going through the pages of this forum might bring up something (?).
Already checked the syicky in our forum; nothing there in the way of a Shaman. I'll check the WOTC one soon, though.

2. Spirit Shaman (in Complete Divine) - 3.5, and Shaman (in Oriental Adventures) - 3.0. That's for WotC. Past that, many more probably. . .


edit --- . . . notably, the Shaman's Handbook (by Green Ronin).
Thanks for the refernces :)
 

I really like the shaman from Green Ronin's Shaman's Handbook. The Shaman from Mongoose's Encylopedia Arcane: Shamans has also received good reviews.
 

Spirit Shaman (not that well made...)

OA Shaman (see above)

Druid, Barbarian, Ranger, Expert, Adept, etc with roleplay aspects...

Totemist from Magic of Incarnum


Shaman doesn't really need to be a class... anymore than "assassin" needs a PrC...
 

Drowbane said:
Shaman doesn't really need to be a class
Uh, I'm not sure how helpful that *opinion* is (i.e., not fact), given the OP.

See, it's fine if you only want to allow the base classes from the core rules, or whatever else floats your boat, but that's not automatically right for others.


Drowbane said:
Druid, Barbarian, Ranger, Expert, Adept, etc with roleplay aspects...
Hm.. yes and no.

After all, you could say more or less the same thing about. . . Rangers: Fighter + Druid + RP; Paladins: Cleric + Fighter + RP; Barbarians: Fighter + RP; Bards: Rogue + Sorcerer + RP. . . . .
In fact, you could quite easily 'make do' with Wizard (Magic-User), Rogue (Thief), Cleric and Fighter. Or Fighting Man and the other two (I forget), from OD&D. . . (?)


If Green Ronin, Mongoose and other RPG companies have seen fit to put out Shaman (and shamanesque) core classes, it suggests to me that: a) it's likely they perceived a demand for them; and b) they must have thought it a viable endeavour.
 

An (appropriate) Rant about the druid

you may recognise this from a previous post of mine; i have edited it a bit and stuff, and although most of this stuff isnt written in stone yet (or properly baalnced) it does give you a good idea of a celtic druid, adn thus if you simplified/got rid of certain class features, added in a bit more about spirits and such, you could have an awesome class going.

******************************

okay, here is my rant regarding WotC chopping up the idea of nature priests into Lycanthropic guys with weird flavour additions, such as changing one apearance at will (thank you A Thousand Faces, via level 13), with spells and a pet wolf. Plus, the weapons allowed in no way corresponds with real-life tales of druids (some druids are mentioned using bows etc (although the ironwood spell can make up for this)

Regarding specifics, i dont like the whole idea of Wild Shaping. This should ability should only be reserved for Bearsarks and Ulfhednar (two real-life Norse prestigue classes [insired from real life] that follow the tales of Beserkers [a base class that i use in the stead of the Barbarian] who, while in a rage, can transform into fearsome wolves (the Ulfhednar) or bears (the Bearsarks). Other than that, The ability to change shape is a Lycanthropic ability, of which tales can be read about from all over the world (Were-boars from Greece, Loup-garou from France, and the hilarious Were-Hare from certain North American groups) Thus, to get a "true" druid class, one shouldn't look too long at the PHB druid.

obviously, i ahve been doing a bit of research, adn have found a few intersting details regarding druids. Most of this was found in "The Oxford Dictionary of Celtic Mythology" (i give it 2 thumbs up)
-There was a druid named Figol (of the Tuatha De Danaan [a race of tall, beautiful, light-haired people. they were warrios and magicains, and some have attributed their desciption with JRR Tolkiens concepts of "elves") who promised to "rain fire from the sky" to kill invading Fomorians (a race of giant. primordial, demonic raiders who came from the sea to invade. this definitively gives druids some major damage dealing spells, etc, adn helps to set the mood, for no-one crosses an angry druid :P
-Another mentionable was a Druid named Eliavres of whom was a Druid-Sorcerer (i think it sounds like a cool character concept)
-Feth Fiada was a Druid ability to summon a fog which made those under it undectable. I think that in gaming terms, you could start off with a basic ability (ie, undetechable Alignment while in the fog) then improve it (ie those within a radius, whose size [the radius's] depends on the caster levelof the druid [to clarify, any sound within this area is not transmitted outside the radius, so those even five feet away from the outside of this radius couldnt hear anyone inside it, adn also, when this ability is gained, could not detect alignments]) and eventually, invisibility (as per the spell, only within the radius, also the silence adn un. align, ability) also, a limit to the times one couls use this per day would be appropriate
-also, i should note, that Feth Fiada's also referred to magical veils that druids and, presumably, non-druids could don to gain the same ability as the actualy fog. Hello "Craft Wonderous Item"!!
-other noteables of Druids include the fact that they werent subject to taxes (if you haev those in your game) they were not required to do battle (sorry, the BAB just dropped to "poor"), had authority over divine worship (spellcasting, etc) they ran the show at sacrifices (it is noted that even human sacrifices might have occured; but only to criminals and such) they were also judges of sorts (some skills there, like sense motive, etc) and they taught their sacred knowledge to pupils. Furthermore, they were healers and were associated with mistletoe for that power adn the druids also considered it unlawful to build temples to the gods or to worship them within walls.

Essentually, a druid is a nature priest (or priestess, the order of the druids wasnt a sexist one) who has a few different abilities at his disposal.

so, the historically correct Druid Class would probably look something like this:

HD = d8
BAB = 1/2 HD (as Wizard)
FORT and WILL good, REF bad
Spells Per Day/Known - as Druid
NO spontaneous casting of "summon" spells.
Animal Companion should stay and Wild Empathy too
Purity of Body (Poisons) and Purity of Body (diseases) should be brought into game play
Keep Trackless Step (maybe usuable only within the Feth Fiada?, or maybe as is?)
bring in the Woodland Stride ability from the Ranger class
and have the Feth Fiada as a class ability, but note: this could become too powerful at higher levels, so dont allow players to cast "meteor swarm" (for ex) from with the confines of the Feth Fiada. If spells are cast within the Feth Fiada, then they should automatically fail, and the Feth Fiada is dispelled and cannot be summoned for another 24 hours. The idea is to be a bit steatly with this, adn times of use/day should help to balance use of this, but i havent yet made specifics.

Weapon and Armour Proficiency: Druid have proficency in all shields (except tower shields, non-metal only) light and medium armours (non-metal only) and (in no specific order) the Dagger, Club, Quarterstaff, Sling, Sickle, Scythe, Short and Long Bows, Greatclub, morningstar, darts, and any one-handed spears

as for class skills go for (6+INT mod)x4 at first level, and 6+Int mod at allother levels, and clas skills should be as follows: Climb, Concentration, Craft, Diplomacy (again, i call it Persuade in my world), Handle Animal, Heal, Intimidate, Jump, Knowledge (all sub-skills) (again, i call it Lore in my world), Listen, Profession, Ride, Sense Motive, Spellcraft, Spot, Survival, Swim and Use Rope.
 

Aus_Snow said:
Uh, I'm not sure how helpful that *opinion* is (i.e., not fact), given the OP.

See, it's fine if you only want to allow the base classes from the core rules, or whatever else floats your boat, but that's not automatically right for others.



Hm.. yes and no.

After all, you could say more or less the same thing about. . . Rangers: Fighter + Druid + RP; Paladins: Cleric + Fighter + RP; Barbarians: Fighter + RP; Bards: Rogue + Sorcerer + RP. . . . .
In fact, you could quite easily 'make do' with Wizard (Magic-User), Rogue (Thief), Cleric and Fighter. Or Fighting Man and the other two (I forget), from OD&D. . . (?)


If Green Ronin, Mongoose and other RPG companies have seen fit to put out Shaman (and shamanesque) core classes, it suggests to me that: a) it's likely they perceived a demand for them; and b) they must have thought it a viable endeavour.

"Uh, I'm not sure how helpful that *opinion* is (i.e., not fact), given the OP." Back at ya. Did you have a point? The man(?) asked a question, I gave my two bits. You do not need to analyze them.

I pointed out four classes that can in a pinch act as Shamans. Namely: Druid, Shaman, Spirit Shaman, and Totemist. And a few that can "fake it" if you're only after the Roleplay aspect.

So again, what was the point of *your* post?

Nyaricus said:
you may recognise this from a previous post of mine; i have edited it a bit and stuff, and although most of this stuff isnt written in stone yet (or properly baalnced) it does give you a good idea of a celtic druid, adn thus if you simplified/got rid of certain class features, added in a bit more about spirits and such, you could have an awesome class going.

******************************

okay, here is my rant regarding WotC chopping up the idea of nature priests into Lycanthropic guys with weird flavour additions, such as changing one apearance at will (thank you A Thousand Faces, via level 13), with spells and a pet wolf. Plus, the weapons allowed in no way corresponds with real-life tales of druids (some druids are mentioned using bows etc (although the ironwood spell can make up for this)

Regarding specifics, i dont like the whole idea of Wild Shaping. This should ability should only be reserved for Bearsarks and Ulfhednar (two real-life Norse prestigue classes [insired from real life] that follow the tales of Beserkers [a base class that i use in the stead of the Barbarian] who, while in a rage, can transform into fearsome wolves (the Ulfhednar) or bears (the Bearsarks). Other than that, The ability to change shape is a Lycanthropic ability, of which tales can be read about from all over the world (Were-boars from Greece, Loup-garou from France, and the hilarious Were-Hare from certain North American groups) Thus, to get a "true" druid class, one shouldn't look too long at the PHB druid.

obviously, i ahve been doing a bit of research, adn have found a few intersting details regarding druids. Most of this was found in "The Oxford Dictionary of Celtic Mythology" (i give it 2 thumbs up)
-There was a druid named Figol (of the Tuatha De Danaan [a race of tall, beautiful, light-haired people. they were warrios and magicains, and some have attributed their desciption with JRR Tolkiens concepts of "elves") who promised to "rain fire from the sky" to kill invading Fomorians (a race of giant. primordial, demonic raiders who came from the sea to invade. this definitively gives druids some major damage dealing spells, etc, adn helps to set the mood, for no-one crosses an angry druid :P
-Another mentionable was a Druid named Eliavres of whom was a Druid-Sorcerer (i think it sounds like a cool character concept)
-Feth Fiada was a Druid ability to summon a fog which made those under it undectable. I think that in gaming terms, you could start off with a basic ability (ie, undetechable Alignment while in the fog) then improve it (ie those within a radius, whose size [the radius's] depends on the caster levelof the druid [to clarify, any sound within this area is not transmitted outside the radius, so those even five feet away from the outside of this radius couldnt hear anyone inside it, adn also, when this ability is gained, could not detect alignments]) and eventually, invisibility (as per the spell, only within the radius, also the silence adn un. align, ability) also, a limit to the times one couls use this per day would be appropriate
-also, i should note, that Feth Fiada's also referred to magical veils that druids and, presumably, non-druids could don to gain the same ability as the actualy fog. Hello "Craft Wonderous Item"!!
-other noteables of Druids include the fact that they werent subject to taxes (if you haev those in your game) they were not required to do battle (sorry, the BAB just dropped to "poor"), had authority over divine worship (spellcasting, etc) they ran the show at sacrifices (it is noted that even human sacrifices might have occured; but only to criminals and such) they were also judges of sorts (some skills there, like sense motive, etc) and they taught their sacred knowledge to pupils. Furthermore, they were healers and were associated with mistletoe for that power adn the druids also considered it unlawful to build temples to the gods or to worship them within walls.

Essentually, a druid is a nature priest (or priestess, the order of the druids wasnt a sexist one) who has a few different abilities at his disposal.

so, the historically correct Druid Class would probably look something like this:

HD = d8
BAB = 1/2 HD (as Wizard)
FORT and WILL good, REF bad
Spells Per Day/Known - as Druid
NO spontaneous casting of "summon" spells.
Animal Companion should stay and Wild Empathy too
Purity of Body (Poisons) and Purity of Body (diseases) should be brought into game play
Keep Trackless Step (maybe usuable only within the Feth Fiada?, or maybe as is?)
bring in the Woodland Stride ability from the Ranger class
and have the Feth Fiada as a class ability, but note: this could become too powerful at higher levels, so dont allow players to cast "meteor swarm" (for ex) from with the confines of the Feth Fiada. If spells are cast within the Feth Fiada, then they should automatically fail, and the Feth Fiada is dispelled and cannot be summoned for another 24 hours. The idea is to be a bit steatly with this, adn times of use/day should help to balance use of this, but i havent yet made specifics.

Weapon and Armour Proficiency: Druid have proficency in all shields (except tower shields, non-metal only) light and medium armours (non-metal only) and (in no specific order) the Dagger, Club, Quarterstaff, Sling, Sickle, Scythe, Short and Long Bows, Greatclub, morningstar, darts, and any one-handed spears

as for class skills go for (6+INT mod)x4 at first level, and 6+Int mod at allother levels, and clas skills should be as follows: Climb, Concentration, Craft, Diplomacy (again, i call it Persuade in my world), Handle Animal, Heal, Intimidate, Jump, Knowledge (all sub-skills) (again, i call it Lore in my world), Listen, Profession, Ride, Sense Motive, Spellcraft, Spot, Survival, Swim and Use Rope.

Good stuff Nyaricus!!
 
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Drowbane said:
Back at ya.
rolleyes.gif



Drowbane said:
Did you have a point?
Yes. You apparently missed it, however.


Drowbane said:
The man(?) asked a question, I gave my two bits.
Yes. I'm aware of that.


Drowbane said:
You do not need to analyze them.
Perhaps we can agree to disagree there, because I get the feeling we won't simply agree.


Drowbane said:
I pointed out four classes that can in a pinch act as Shamans. Namely: Druid, Shaman, Spirit Shaman, and Totemist. And a few that can "fake it" if you're only after the Roleplay aspect.
That is some of what you said, yes.


Drowbane said:
So again, what was the point of *your* post?
rolleyes.gif
Never mind.
 

Shades of Green said:
1) Has anyone designed a Shaman core class/variant on Druid?

I'm in the process of it right now, myself.

I started with a Druid base, then changed them to a spontaneous caster. (They're still Wisdom-based.) I also give Druids a single Domain from a short list of nature-oriented Domains.

I want to either scale down or remove wild shape-- probably limiting it to Medium or smaller animals-- so that they still have scouting-forms, but they won't have the nasty combat forms. Master of Many Forms and Warshaper will be available for more dedicated shapeshifters, and since I'm using the Gestalt rules, they need not sacrifice spellcasting.

I was originally going to use the Aspects of Nature variant from Unearthed Arcana, but I realized it didn't really suit what I was trying to accomplish.

I'm looking at some of the abilities from Spirit Shaman in Complete Divine-- mostly the x/cold iron DR and the Fey transformation at level 20. (Which reminds me, I'll have to change the Warlock's DR...) Spirit Sight and Chastise Spirits are also options.

I'll probably post a tentative version of it up here when I'm closer to finished.
 

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