PrC - Crime Lord - Comments Please

In my campaign one of the PC's is involved in the thieves guild and has queried wether he can take a prestige class to rise in the ranks. We got thinking over a few beers and decided that a PrC for a crime lord would be a nice touch, especially for NPC's, but also as something to aim for your average thief. The first draft was pronounced too light for a PC, but OK for an NPC, so I added uncanny dodge and improved reactions to make progression more worthwhile. Theres not too much at the higher levels because Reputation and Leadership both have level dependent effects. Anyhow heres the class - I started with an assassin and then ripped out the killing stuff and replaced it with leadership skills so please let me know what you think (I've attached a word doc with all the tables in if you want to read in DMG style)

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For version 2 i removed the spells which no-one seemed to like, added some sneak attack and focussed the new abilities on enhancing the leadership and reputation elements. Some of these might make reasonable feats.....


THE CRIME LORD (VERSION 2 - see attachment for Version 1)
Hit Die: d6.
Requirements
To qualify to become a crime lord, a character must fulfill all the following criteria.
Alignment: Any (normally opposed to the ruling alignment of the society)
Skills: Diplomacy 6 ranks, Intimidate 10 ranks, Disguise 4 Ranks, Perform (Orate) 3 Ranks

Feats: Leadership
Special: The character must be engaged in illegal activity.

Whether an outlaw in the woods, fighting an evil tyrant, or the master criminal in a sprawling city, the leader of the rogues, sneaks and ne’er do wells that make up the criminal elements is a specialist role.
Although a crime lord is a position of respect and garners loyalty, the character must never forget that he is a target for both the authorities and other criminal activities. In order to be able to enjoy the fruits of his labours the crime lord will often have a separate, legitimate identity. It is up to the character which, if any, of these identities is his true one


Class Skills
The crime lord’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Balance (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Climb (Str), Craft (Int), Decipher Script (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Disable Device (Int), Disguise (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Forgery (Int), Gather Information (Cha), Hide (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Open Lock (Dex), Perform (Orate), Search (Int), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Spot (Wis), Swim (Str), Tumble (Dex), Use Magic Device (Cha), and Use Rope (Dex).
Skill Points at Each Level: 4 + Int modifier.

BAB - as Rogue, Good reflex saves, poor will & fortitude saves

Special ability table
1 - Connected, Reputation, Bonus Feat*
2 - Inspire Fear, uncanny dodge
3 - Improved Intimidate, Sneak attack +1d6
4 - Inspire Courage, Improved Reaction +2,
5 - Enhanced Reputation, Bonus Feat*
6 - Enhanced Leadership, Sneak attack +2d6
7 - Enhanced Intimidate, Improved uncanny dodge
8 - Faithful followers, Improved Reaction +4, Bonus Feat*
9 - Frightful Reputation, Sneak attack +3d6

Class Features
All of the following are Class Features of the crime lord prestige class.
Weapon and Armour Proficiency: Crime lords are proficient with the crossbow (light), dagger (any type), dart, rapier, sap, short bow (normal and composite), and short sword. Crime lords are proficient with light armour but not with shields.
Connected (Ex): as per the birthright feat. If this Feat is already possessed, (and at 3rd level, and every two levels thereafter) the crime lord can either extend the area affected by this feat, or add another organization he is linked to (e.g. at first level he is connected to the thieves guild, by third he has contacts within the local guild council, by fifth he is linked to the local law enforcement, and by seventh he has contacts at court, at ninth he extends his influence to the entire city and not just the port area).

Reputation (ex): The crime lord adds his crime lord level to checks made against Diplomacy, Gather Information & Sense Motive. He also adds to Intimidate, though this is not effective when in his ‘legitimate’ identity (see text)

Enhanced Reputation (Ex): When on the crime lords business, his followers & cohort can add half the crime lords reputation bonus to their skill rolls

Inspire Courage (Su): A crime lord can use a speech to inspire courage in his allies (including himself ), bolstering them against fear and improving their combat abilities. To be affected, an ally must be able to hear the crime lord. The effect lasts for as long as the ally hears the crime lord and for 5 rounds thereafter. An affected ally receives a +1 morale bonus on saving throws against charm and fear effects and a +1 morale bonus on attack and weapon damage rolls. At 8th level this bonus increases to +2

Inspire Fear (Su): Instead of inspiring courage in his allies, a crime lord may inspire fear in his enemies. This gives a -1 morale penalty to rolls affected by inspire courage. To be effective the enemy must be able to understand the Crime lord. At 8th level this penalty increases to +2. Note: although the crime lord can only impose one effect each round of talking, he can have both effects in operation simultaneously due to the ‘5 round thereafter’ effect

Improved Intimidate (Ex); The effect of intimidate lasts 1 round plus 1 round for every two crime lord levels above 1st

Enhanced Intimidate (Ex): When intimidating opponents it effects all enemies within a 30’ radius of the crime lord. The effect stacks with improved intimidate

Frightful Reputation (Su): Anyone of lower HD than the crime lord who is capable of recognising him will be shaken (will save DC 15+ Cha bonus) while within 100’. If the opponent is 5HD or more lower than the crime lords level then the opponent will be panicked.

Enhanced Leadership (Ex): The crime lord adds his Crime lord level as a bonus to the ‘leadership’ score (DMG p 106) for the purpose of determining number and level of followers. He also has the option of gaining additional cohorts providing the total levels of his cohorts do not exceed the maximum on the table. The normal restrictions for cohort maximum level apply

Faithful followers (Ex): His followers gain a bonus to fear saves equal to the half the crime lords level when within 100’ of the crime lord. In addition the crime lord no longer takes penalty’s to his leadership score for the death of followers (even if directly caused by the crime lord) & receives new followers in half the time it would otherwise take

Uncanny Dodge (Ex): Starting at 2nd level, a crime lord retains his Dexterity bonus to AC (if any) regardless of being caught flat-footed or struck by an invisible attacker. (He still loses any Dexterity bonus to AC if immobilized.)
If a character gains uncanny dodge from a second class the character automatically gains improved uncanny dodge (see below).

Improved Reaction (Ex): At 4th level, a crime lord gains a +2 bonus on initiative checks.
At 8th level, the bonus increases to +4. This bonus stacks with the benefit provided by the Improved Initiative feat

Improved Uncanny Dodge (Ex): A crime lord can no longer be flanked, since he can react to opponents on opposite sides of him as easily as he can react to a single attacker. This defense denies rogues the ability to use flank attacks to sneak attack the crime lord. The exception to this defense is that a rogue at least four levels higher than the crime lord can flank him (and thus sneak attack him).
If a character gains uncanny dodge (see above) from a second class the character automatically gains improved uncanny dodge, and the levels from those classes stack to determine the minimum rogue level required to flank the character.

Bonus Feat: The feat must be taken from the following list: Deceitful, Diligent, Investigator, Negotiator, Persuasive. If all of these feats are possessed then Skill Focus in any class skill may be taken instead

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Connected [Birthright Feat]
You have many connections within an organisation and / or a region
Benefit: Choose a specific Region & Organisation with the agreement of the DM. When within the region or organisation, using the following skills, you can always take twenty providing you have time and ability to consult your contacts. Sense motive, Intimidate, Bluff, Gather Information - It will normally take several hours to find the contacts required unless you have thoroughly prepared.
Sample organisations include Lords Court, Merchants Guild, Thieves Guild, City Guard, Army, Rangers, Arcane Guild
Special: What goes around comes around - to retain these contacts you may be called upon to return the favour - you also gain a reputation as being associated with the organisation involved
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The Organisation

When established as a criminal organization, the crime lords activities will bring in an income sufficient to support all his followers / cohort, run (but not build or purchase) a stronghold or hide-away appropriate to the area, and allow the crime lord to maintain a wealthy lifestyle.

The organization is assumed to run itself (providing at least one cohort is left in charge in the characters absence), but certain assumptions about the organization should be made by the character which act as default decisions to avoid role-playing every situation.

1. Leadership style –strong-weak, just-cruel, despotic-populist.
2. Organisation style – Loose, Fractioned, Ruling Council, Autocratic, Democratic, Centralist etc
3. Rules – Rob from rich / outsiders / specific race / organisation only, do not kill / kill for money, spread fear / support poor etc
3. Attitude to other criminal organisations, and to independent operators

The DM will determine the attitude of the law, of merchants or other affected organizations to this organization though the character can attempt to modify this over time.

If the character is taking over an existing organisation, and bringing in a very different leadership style there may be some friction. In the worse case a split could occur between the characters loyal followers and the remaining members of the guild leading to conflict.

Lastly, the organization does require leadership. Although the character may opt to leave a cohort in charge in his absence, prolonged or repeated absence may give rise to alternative leaders emerging (in game terms, a cohort/followers will become independent allowing the crime lord to recruit alternative followers

I would be the thief in question.

As a thief based prestige class I think, not having sneak attack progresion makes it a weak option for a PC. The spell list is also very utilitarian. Where as I agree it make a good class for an NPC and has great role playing optertunities, I am concerned that it would make me even weaker in combat. An area I am currently stuggling help the party in with.

Combat options

1. Spells - True strike (auto hit), Cats grace gives +2 Ac, +2 Att (Range & finesse), higher levels deep slumber and dimension door are quite useful as well.
potentially swop in spells such as Mage Armour, or other defensive options.
2. Cohort - obvious is a bodyguard Fighter, since Enhanced leadership gives a second Cohort that could be a spellcaster who makes potions etc on the cheap.
3. Improved Reaction is very useful combined with high dex and improved initiative in enabling the crime lord to dictate combat
Crime lord is also good at Feint and intimidate due to the Reputation Bonus

I am thinking about a reduced progression for sneak attack but I'm worried that might overpower it and mean you have to lose some of the other more relevant abilities

Not to undermine your work, but isn't there a "crime boss" PrC in Complete Adventurer, or was it in Song & Silence? I don't remember much about ti, apart from one of it's abilties was that low level characters would be so scraed by him they couldn't attack, or something...

Song and Silence has "Outlaw of the Crimson Road" which has a very different feel. Other than "Dread Pirate", I see nothing in Complete Adventurer of this sort of ilk...

Fieari said:

Song and Silence has "Outlaw of the Crimson Road" which has a very different feel. Other than "Dread Pirate", I see nothing in Complete Adventurer of this sort of ilk...

Click to expand...

Hmm, maybe I was thinking of another supplement entirely. I thought it was in of those two books. My mistake, then...

Honestly, since this class is SO front-loaded, I'd almost wanna say: "Why is this a 10 level PrC?" until I look again, and see that most class abilities are limited by levels in the PrC. However, that tells me that instead, the PrC's abilities need to be changed around a bit.

Sneak attack improvement might be a good idea actually, but certainly not up to +5d6, though +3d6 might not be too bad.

Improved Reputation needs to be a bit higher level I think. Perhaps 5th or so. This also needs a 'capstone'-like ability: it, like the rogue, suffers from a lack of compelling reasons to not take another class at it's highest level, other than some fairly minor bonuses that probably won't show up in combat.

I don't see the reason for spellcasting; it doesn't fit with the flavor elsewhere. Assassins have often had the mystical aspect associated with spellcasting. Crime lords are generally more prone to physical attacks (usually carried out by henchmen).

I don't see Sneak Attack as needed for this class or that it even should be here. This is a PrC for someone who should already have SA, as well as Uncanny Dodge. This class is great for use in social situations, but it would not improve combat ability significantly, if, at all. This class does not seemed like it was designed for that anyway. It seems like it was more for running a guild rather than adventuring, which is what the PC in questions should be doing anyway if he's in charge of a guild. Day to day management, meetings, etc. would take up nearly all his time and adventuring would be a thing of the past.

That said, I think this is an excellent PrC for an NPC, but a horrible one for a PC.

One other thing; spells. I think they should be left out entirely. There is nothing magical about being a crime lord, running guilds etc. And like combat, adventuring, etc., the character realistically (as far as that word goes) just would not have the time to pick up a spellbook and start slinging spells.

Requirements are ok, but could be greatly improved. I would say add Bluff and Sense Motive to the skills required and make the minimum ranks at 12 instead of 5. If you leave out spells, you don't need to mess with that Arcane Blood (again, magic having nothing with being a mob boss). I would add Skill Focus (Bluff) to the feats and possibly 1 other. The requirement of being engaged in illegal activity is kind of redundant since many PC adventures themselves require illegal activity (trespassing, assault, murder, theft, etc.) and for a Rogue (which this class was designed for), illegal activity is practically a given and too easy to meet that it couldn't even be considered a requirement.

General view seems to be against spells - that does give a few more options for sneak attack (every 3 or 4 levels?), more skill points, or maybe some other feats (tactical...?) or maybe some bard type inspire abilities (more skills is the obvious, but then its not hugely different from a standard rogue)

I take the point about the prereqs being light, but i do think leadership is a big price to pay as a feat since its benefits are really tied to the campaign scenario rather than the character

The point of the class wasnt so much to be the manager of a guild as its leader - someone who inspires fear and loyalty in equal amounts and only has to click his fingers for things to happen. Its difficult to inspire fear if your abilities are limited to double entry book keeping, (and thats what your cohort / followers are for) but i do want this class to be different from a standard rogue in practice as well as flavour.


Thanks for the comments so far, please keep 'em coming - even if we never get a playable PC class out of it, at least i know what my NPC's will be taking next level......

Crime Lord PrC's should take the character away from normal adventuring, unless that adventuring turns into a 'handle the city business' sort of deal.

The supplement Thurbane is thinking of is either Legend and Lairs "Traps and Treachery" that includes some very nice rules on the mechanics of Guild membership and a decent Crime Lord PrC {focused mainly on running the Guild, with lots in common with what you posted upthread..altho no spells} or Gary Gygax's Canting Crew that has a ton of roleplaying information on the darker sides of business and a number of PrC's that suit various roles within the Guild, such as Brawler, Sneak Thief, Urban Ranger,...etc..

Just off the little information posted here I would suggest a different lok than what you have. The Crime Lord concept seems opposed to the players intent of being a contributing factor in the group combat wise. Perhaps Creative Mountain Games pdf "Contacts, Backgrounds, Honors, and Reputations" could add enough {the parts I use are the reputation rules for being recognized and the contacts rules...}
[sblock]Contacts are NPCs that can provide either information, influence, or a skill for the PC. The player gets to define the contact with acceptance by the GM. The contacts usefullness is counterbalanced by their accessability...meaning if you want a contact that you can be reached at any hour of the day regardless of other activities, that contact won't be able to pull of spectacular stuff. Generally speaking the contact will be anywhere from 1/3 to 1/2 the level of the PC.

An example would be a contact of the town drunk, who is in fact a rumor monger and keeps a close eye on who comes and goes. Easy to access, but is limited in what information you can glean from him.
[/sblock]

Or possibly a feat could be taken that increases the standing in the guild, with mechanical side effects. For instance something like:
Feat: Guild Promotion
Prereq: Membership in a specific guild
Benefits: You can a new rank within the guild.
You also gain 1 additional Contact and +1 reputation bonus to your leadership score.


YMMV