New Race -- my take on the gnome

I've never much liked the D&D gnome. It's too closely influenced by the Dragonlance tinker gnome (more in player understanding than mechanics, perhaps), and it never seemed to fit in my campaign.

I liked their nature-focused aspect, though, and vowed to rewrite the gnome for that role. I did so, announcing the results to my group, and promptly ignored it as a PC race for some time, as no one showed interest in playing one.

Now I have a player with a gnome character, a bard. I figured it would be a good idea to see if the mechanics were sound, so I thought I'd post them here. Post your comments, suggestions, or random derision as desired...

Gnome
—Small Fey
— –2 Str, +2 Dex, +2 Wis, +2 Cha
—Base land speed: 20 feet
—Low–light vision
—Racial Hit Dice: A gnome begins with 3d6 Hit Dice, BAB +1, and base saves +1/+3/+3. A gnome's fey levels give it 6 x (6 + Int modifier) skill points and two feats. Its class skills are Bluff, Disguise, Escape Artist, Listen, Move Silently, Sense Motive, and Survival.
—Carrying capacity as though one size category smaller
— +2 racial bonus to Move Silently
—Spell-like Abilities: 1/day—animal messengerM, ghost sound, invisibility, jump, magic stone, pass without trace. (Animal messenger requires its normal material component, despite being a spell-like ability.)
— Speak with Animals (Ex): At will
— +1 dodge bonus to AC
—Automatic language: Sylvan 2 ranks, elven 1 rank, regional 1 rank. Bonus languages: Common, Gnoll, Goblin, Halfling. (Under the standard system, Sylvan and Elven are automatic languages.)
—Favored class: Druid

Height: 2' + 1d6"; weight 10 lb + x2d4 oz. (For the rest of the world, height 60 + 1d20 cm; mass 4.5kg + x(10 x 1d20)g.)

Gnomerific

I like the ideas you have here, but you need to give the race an ECL, considering its abilities. I'm assuming you just forgot to include it.

As it stands, your gnome probably has an ECL +3. I can't imagine going lower than that, considering the real game breakers (3 HD w6! skill points and invisibility 1/day), but your race almost pushes to +4, with the two good saves, racial ability modifiers, and other good stuff.

I personally would tone it down a bit; I think that most truly playable races should be ECL +2 or less. I think that you should give one less HD, get rid of the bonus to wisdom or charisma, give good reflex saves only, four skill points, and add knowledge: nature and handle animal to the class skills list. I would also get rid of one of the feats, perhaps making the remaining feat Animal Affinity. You might be able to get away with two feats if one of them is Animal Affinity. That would probably bring the race down to ECL +2, perhaps pushing ECL +3, which is where I would take it.

But that is just my opinion. Even if you decide to keep your gnome as is, it might be a good idea to add some weapon proficiencies, perhaps as Druid, or a similar small selection of weapons, to go along with the racial HD.

And I hate gnomes. Your version almost makes them worth keeping around, but it is too powerful for my taste.

Cool idea. Since Fey HD are generally regarded as poor, you've covered the LA/ECL angle nicely.

Those racial HD need a bigger skill list, though. IMHO, Gnomes should be accomplished Rogues, Wizards, Bards and/or Druids. I think their racial skill list should include such "flavor" skills as: Sleight of Hand, Craft (particularly Alchemy), Knowlege (especially Arcana and Nature), Profession, Spellcraft, Handle Animal, Perform and Diplomacy. It would not be overpowered if it also included Spot, Tumble and Hide.

I do not like the bonuses to Wis and Cha, unless you add a penalty to Con.

In place of the many spell-like abilities, consider adding 1 level of spellcasting to their racial levels ("+1 level Bard or Druid"). This gives your PCs a bit more flexibility.

-- N

Frum said:

I like the ideas you have here, but you need to give the race an ECL, considering its abilities. I'm assuming you just forgot to include it.

As it stands, your gnome probably has an ECL +3. I can't imagine going lower than that, considering the real game breakers (3 HD w6! skill points and invisibility 1/day), but your race almost pushes to +4, with the two good saves, racial ability modifiers, and other good stuff.

Click to expand...

No, I didn't forget. I thought that ECL 3 worked nicely, so they're LA +0 in my campaign at the moment.

I don't really see them as ECL 4, though. While they do get ability boosts, none are above +2 and it would be hard to take advantage of all of them. Their weaknesses are pretty apparent: few hit points and low BA (if fighting) and three levels without spellcasting (if casting).

If you really think they should be ECL 4, I'd like to hear more about why you think so. The gnome character is actually pretty weak right now... but I'll get to that later.

Frum said:

I personally would tone it down a bit; I think that most truly playable races should be ECL +2 or less. I think that you should give one less HD, get rid of the bonus to wisdom or charisma, give good reflex saves only, four skill points, and add knowledge: nature and handle animal to the class skills list. I would also get rid of one of the feats, perhaps making the remaining feat Animal Affinity. You might be able to get away with two feats if one of them is Animal Affinity. That would probably bring the race down to ECL +2, perhaps pushing ECL +3, which is where I would take it.

But that is just my opinion. Even if you decide to keep your gnome as is, it might be a good idea to add some weapon proficiencies, perhaps as Druid, or a similar small selection of weapons, to go along with the racial HD.

Click to expand...

While these aren't bad ideas, they're against my design principles for this race: I wanted a 3-HD fey (and thus ECL 3+) with a bonus to Cha and a propensity for nature and (minor?) magics.

Frum said:

And I hate gnomes. Your version almost makes them worth keeping around, but it is too powerful for my taste.

Click to expand...

I've always hated the standard gnomes, but hopefully these are different. It's certainly an experience for the player!

Nifft said:

Cool idea. Since Fey HD are generally regarded as poor, you've covered the LA/ECL angle nicely.

Click to expand...

That was my intent. Also note that I chose 3 HD because it makes BA hurt the most... +1 over 3 levels. Ouch.

Nifft said:

Those racial HD need a bigger skill list, though. IMHO, Gnomes should be accomplished Rogues, Wizards, Bards and/or Druids. I think their racial skill list should include such "flavor" skills as: Sleight of Hand, Craft (particularly Alchemy), Knowlege (especially Arcana and Nature), Profession, Spellcraft, Handle Animal, Perform and Diplomacy. It would not be overpowered if it also included Spot, Tumble and Hide.

Click to expand...

My gnomes are forest-dwelling fey; Craft (alchemy) and Knowledge (arcana) don't fit too well in my mind. They're a bit antisocial with nongnomes, playing pranks on the big folk and all, so no Diplomacy.

Having said that, I agree that they need more skills and your list is good. What would you say if I added Handle Animal, Knowledge (nature), Perform (all), Sleight of Hand, and Spot?

Nifft said:

I do not like the bonuses to Wis and Cha, unless you add a penalty to Con.

In place of the many spell-like abilities, consider adding 1 level of spellcasting to their racial levels ("+1 level Bard or Druid"). This gives your PCs a bit more flexibility.

Click to expand...

Why don't you like the bonus to Wis and Cha?

Spell-like abilities make the gnome*. Having said that, I would have no problems giving out a spellcaster level or two in bard/druid if I thought I could get away with it without affecting LA. +1 spellcasting in bard is weak (shouldn't really affect LA), but without the same in druid it encourages bards too much, and that should be their best class (for flavor purposes).

* To be followed up in a later post on this thread: my gnome paragon class.

Skills: So long as someone with a +2 Int bonus isn't confined (so that you have at least 10 class skills), the specifics aren't that important. I'd make sure to add Craft, especially Craft (Alchemy), since those items are great for playing tricks. Sleight of Hand and Forgery are other options. Bluff covers lying, so that's fine. Spot/Listen -- if they're in the woods a lot, those are key.

Okay, so offer either:
- weaker spell-like abilities +1 level Druid spellcasting, or
- +2 levels Bard spellcasting (which are the trixie enchantment/illusion spells anyway).

The key thing here is choice. Default Gnome powers are sometimes used, sometimes not. Giving more 1/day powers is a boon to players who are good at remembering such stuff, but not all players are.

You may also want to add some [Fey] feats, like Woodland Stride and/or Trackless Step, so that Gnomes can pay for racial bonuses if they want them.

-- N

Oh, why not Wis and Cha: I don't like unbalanced stat bonuses. I'd have to see it in play before deciding for sure, but IMHO both bonuses could be balanced by a Con penalty, since that's a huge penalty for Bards and a moderate one for Druids.

-- N

Yesh! powerful. Did you intend it to be played or did you go like WotC and beef up aa not weak, but lesser played race? I'd tone it down.

Nifft said:

Skills: So long as someone with a +2 Int bonus isn't confined (so that you have at least 10 class skills), the specifics aren't that important. I'd make sure to add Craft, especially Craft (Alchemy), since those items are great for playing tricks. Sleight of Hand and Forgery are other options. Bluff covers lying, so that's fine. Spot/Listen -- if they're in the woods a lot, those are key.

Click to expand...

Actually, the gnome in my campaign did have Int 14, so he took a cross-class skill. I think I'll add the skills I mentioned above, though, on your recommendation.

Most gnomes will have never seen a city and wouldn't know anything about alchemy or forgery, so that's inappropriate for my race.

Nifft said:

Okay, so offer either:
- weaker spell-like abilities +1 level Druid spellcasting, or
- +2 levels Bard spellcasting (which are the trixie enchantment/illusion spells anyway).

The key thing here is choice. Default Gnome powers are sometimes used, sometimes not. Giving more 1/day powers is a boon to players who are good at remembering such stuff, but not all players are.

Click to expand...

Do you think that would increase their power beyond ECL 3?

Nifft said:

Oh, why not Wis and Cha: I don't like unbalanced stat bonuses. I'd have to see it in play before deciding for sure, but IMHO both bonuses could be balanced by a Con penalty, since that's a huge penalty for Bards and a moderate one for Druids.

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I see the loss of spellcasting as a major penalty for both, not to mention (in 3.5) the loss of bardic music abilities since it's not tied just to ranks anymore.

I have a 1 HD, LA +1 race that grants +4 Int, +2 Cha, +2 Dex, -2 Str, -2 Con -- very unbalanced stats. I also use the hobgoblin (+2 Str, +2 Dex, LA +1), so this doesn't bother me.

Really, the benefits are hard to use together -- Dex and Cha aren't very good as a druid, and Wis isn't useful as a bard (and the Str penalty hurts more). It just helps flesh out exactly what gnomes are in my world, and gives them more class options.

Ferret said:

Yesh! powerful. Did you intend it to be played or did you go like WotC and beef up aa not weak, but lesser played race? I'd tone it down.

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I intend for it to be available for PCs to play, if they wish. As I mentioned it's only been played once in all the time it's been open to PCs.

I'm curious to see why you think the race is powerful. I tend to think it's weak -- the gnome character is the weakest in the group despite respectable stats. Sure, it grants decent ability bonuses and some special abilities, but it costs 3 levels, which give a bad HD and only +1 BA over 3 levels, making combat somewhere between difficult and near-impossible. With mental boosts it is a good caster, except that it loses 3 spellcasting levels. A gnome Sor8 casts 4th level spells when the human Wiz11 casts 6th level spells, for example.

Do you have a particular class or class combination for which this gnome is overpowered?