d20 or Bust?

Is it just me, or does it seem that many people who play 3.x D&D refuse to play any game that doesn't use the d20 rules? If so, why? Why refuse to try something different?

There are some great (or not-so-great, but work for that particular game) systems: Call of Cthulhu, GDW's house rules (TW2K v2.2, Dark Conspiracy, etc.), Shadowrun, Blue Planet, WEG's d6 and TORG systems, Paranoia!, Star Frontiers, Marvel Superheroes, DC Heroes, even OD&D/AD&D...

I wonder if a ruleset gives a game as much (or more) of it's feel than the campaign setting?

Looking at the different rulesets, it seems that those games that desire "superheroic" feel end up using either an exponential system (TORG, DC Heroes) or a percentile system (Marvel Superheroes), while those that strive for "realism in a fantastic setting" use a percentile system almost exclusively (Call of Cthulhu, Star Frontiers, Runequest, Rolemaster, etc) - GDW's rules being the exception (but, actually I love the simplicity and realism that their system uses.)

What about dice-pool systems like Shadowrun or Vampire?

Do you find that you prefer "skill-based" systems or "level-based" systems? I know some players seem a bit discouraged when they play systems that don't award huge amounts of experience points (such as TW2K's system of awarding 1 or 2 xp per session - since it is completely skills based), especially after playing with a system like D&D that awards hundreds or thousands of xp at a time.

I'm sure that many people here play games other than D&D - but, being a D&D fan site, D&D is likely to be the primary game of the average poster on these boards.

For me - I have played other games in the past, but I'm pretty happy with D&D. It's not that I believe it to be superior to other games, but that I'm used to it and have no real desire to learn a new system. That's not to say I wouldn't if my gaming group decided they were fed up with D&D.

Probably the same reasons why most Storyteller gamers don't want to play anything that is non-Storyteller games: Preference and Rules Familiarity.

Although the majority of d20 gamers are D&D gamers, even most of them don't play non-D&D d20 games for reasons of their own. That's why D&D fanbase dwarfs d20 Modern and Star Wars fanbases combined when it comes to WotC's RPG lines.

There is a small minority that play many RPGs and I'm one of them. Some I enjoy playing (like Star Trek by Last Unicorn Games) some I don't and prefer to avoid (d6 System).

D&D and GURPS, mostly. StoryTeller when I'm feeling self-abusive

People stick to what thjey know. It can also be an ivestiment issue, I have 200 d20 books why would I want to spend moeny on a new system when i have all this d20 stuff.

However, if people won't play a non d20 game or non story teller game or what ever just becasue its different then what they know: those people get no respect from me.

3catcircus said:

Is it just me, or does it seem that many people who play 3.x D&D refuse to play any game that doesn't use the d20 rules? If so, why? Why refuse to try something different?

There are some great (or not-so-great, but work for that particular game) systems: Call of Cthulhu, GDW's house rules (TW2K v2.2, Dark Conspiracy, etc.), Shadowrun, Blue Planet, WEG's d6 and TORG systems, Paranoia!, Star Frontiers, Marvel Superheroes, DC Heroes, even OD&D/AD&D...

Click to expand...

I do play other games on occasion, but I feel the burden is on the non-20 games here, not the d20 games, to show some quality that makes it worthwhile. Why? I know d20 and my players know d20. Learning a new systems, going through the mistakes and less-than-optimal play that occurs when you are just learning a system, and so forth, are time invested that I would rather be doing quality gaming. These days I only have one 4-6 hour block a week to spend with my players, and if I am going to be squandering one or more of those learning a new system, there had better be a good reason.

In some of your listed games, I can see the point. I don't feel d20 is especially well suited to supers play, and would rather use HERO or DC Heroes for those. But of others you are listed, I gotta say I actively prefer d20, even if my players knew the system. d6 WEG and Shadowrun and WoD Storyteller (and moce dice pool style systems, for that matter) I really dislike.

CoC is an unusual case. I've played it for years, but really feel the skill system is outdated, but I still think chargen is better than the d20 version. I think if I had a hankering to run Cthulhu mythos, I'd use the d20 version, but yank out the chargen and use a toned down version of d20 modern instead.

3catcircus said:

Is it just me, or does it seem that many people who play 3.x D&D refuse to play any game that doesn't use the d20 rules?

Click to expand...

Yes, it's just you.

3catcircus said:

Is it just me, or does it seem that many people who play 3.x D&D refuse to play any game that doesn't use the d20 rules? If so, why? Why refuse to try something different?

Click to expand...

My players prefer to stick with d20 mainly because we have very limited gaming time, and they want to spend as much time as possible gaming rather than learning rules; also because d20 is a system we can all agree on (I prefer HERO but like d20 all right, the other player/GM hates HERO but will play d20 genre games, and the third player learned with D&D 3.x and hasn't yet tried any other systems).

Given that we're lucky to game twice in a single month, much less every week, we stick with d20 to maximize play time.

-The Gneech

I'm trying to branch out our gaming group to Paranoia or non-d20 Call of Cthulhu, but everyone pretty much wants to stick to d20. I guess there is a learning curve, but really, how hard is it to learn some of the simpler systems out there? I mean, we all figured out (or think we figured out) d20, which ain't exactly the most intuitive ruleset in existence (Attacks of Opportunity, anyone?) If you can muddle your way thru playing d20 D&D, playing the other stuff should be a snap. I mean, Paranoia ain't exactly taxing on the ol' grey matter.

(On the other hand, creating a PC in the HERO system requires at least a PhD in fractional accounting)

I have the basics of about a dozen different systems in my head -- D20, Ars Magica, Paranoia, BRP, LUG Trek, Decipher Trek, GURPS, Rolemaster, Over the Edge, Storyteller, Fuzion, etc.

I never have a problem switching systems; overall, I think that given systems map given situations better than others. D20 does not do grim-n-gritty very well, despite the various attempts at that, and it tends to be Way Over The Top in its magic, but for all that it is a fairly easy system in which to learn the basics. Variant statements could be made for each of the above-named systems, along with several others.

The point is, I am willing to play under any set of rules as long as I like the GM; equally, I am quite willing to switch systems if I feel one or another set of rules fits the mood I am trying to develop in my own games.

I owe very little system-loyalty.