Nature's Protector PRC - please read and comment

Well, this is my first post, but I find myself in need of some objective viewpoints. The following is a prestige class made by a player in my campaign, and it's designed to be a fighting druid. I had some concerns about it's balance when it was first presented to me, when it was substantially stronger (included stronger forms of power attack like frenzied berserker), but I revised it to the following. Still, now that I have seen it in use for a few levels, I find that the character with this class seems far and away dominant to any other PC. The character is a brb1/drd7/NaP4 now.


Nature’s Protector

The essence of Altain is a powerful yet fragile energy that many draw upon in which to strengthen themselves and better the world. There lies a balance between the various ways in which individuals use this energy. Druids draw in Nature’s power and form it into spells, reshape themselves and the land, and control it’s bounty in plants and animals. Rangers do this to a lesser degree but rather master the use of Nature’s energy to skillfully defend the land by sword, bow, hunting, and tracking. Barbarians revel in the passion and furry that incites their bodies with strength and power as Nature’s magical nectar course through them. There are a few of Nature’s soldiers that walk the balance between these methods of control and use; they are called Nature’s Protectors. They see the value in all Natures gifts and swear to defend her at all costs.

Alignment: Neutral good, Lawful neutral, Neutral, or Chaotic neutral.
Hit Die: D8

Requirements
To qualify to become one of Nature’s Protectors, a character must fulfill all the following criteria.
Base Attack Bonus: +6
Feat: Power Attack
Knowledge (Nature): 8 Ranks
Survival: 8 Ranks
Ability to Rage or Ability to Wild Shape
Spells: Access to at least 1st level Divine Spells


Class Skills
The Nature’s Protector’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Concentration (Con), Handle Animal (Cha), Knowledge (Nature) (Int), Listen (Wis), Spellcraft (Int), Spot (Wis), Survival (Wis).

Skill Points at Each Level: 4 + Int Modifier



Nature’s Protector

Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special Ability Spells per Day

1 +0 +2 +0 +2 Natural Armor +2, Animal Companion +1 level of existing class
2 +1 +3 +0 +3 Con +2(Inherent) +1 level of existing class
3 +2 +3 +1 +3 Mettle, Wpn Spcz +1 level of existing class
4 +3 +4 +1 +4 Rapid Healing(1.5x rate) +1 level of existing class
5 +3 +4 +1 +4 Natural Armor +4 +1 level of existing class
6 +4 +5 +2 +5 Iron Will +1 level of existing class
7 +5 +5 +2 +5 Rage or Great Rage +1 level of existing class
8 +6 +6 +2 +6 Natural Armor +6 +1 level of existing class
9 +6 +6 +3 +6 track rolls +4 +1 level of existing class
10 +7 +7 +3 +7 One with Nature +1 level of existing class

One with Nature
Upon reaching 10th level in Nature’s Protector, the character is offered the ultimate gift. Nature’s Protector becomes one with the Land itself and is but an extension of it. She/he can sense all that goes on within 1 mile/per level as if she/he were there personally. He has the knowledge, memories, and experience of the Land. This in-severable bond strengthens the Protector’s body and spirit, providing a +4 inherent bonus to Strength and Wisdom when in physical contact with the land. Conversely, this bond causes the Nature’s Protector to feel the effects laid upon the Land; if the Land is severely marred so shall she/he be, if the Land is poisoned then she/he will feel the effects, if a large area of the Land is destroyed then she/he will suffer damage as well. These effects can be healed on the Nature’s Protector but if she/he does not sooth the Land’s pain by the next day his ailments return.


I know I look on this class with a lot of bias, as the GM in the game, so I'd love to hear other opinions from people removed. Any comments on how to bring back balance (if I'm right and it's needed) would also be appreciated .

Island Druid

Full spellcasting, special abilities out the wazoo, 2 good saves, full animal companion progression, AND inherent bonuses to everything good? No. Friggin'. Way.

Take a look at Complete Warrior, specifically Nature's Warrior and/or War Shaper.

I'll do a re-work of a rage/wild shape focused melee druid PrC if you'd like.

-- N

Nifft said:

Full spellcasting, special abilities out the wazoo, 2 good saves, full animal companion progression, AND inherent bonuses to everything good? No. Friggin'. Way.

Take a look at Complete Warrior, specifically Nature's Warrior and/or War Shaper.

I'll do a re-work of a rage/wild shape focused melee druid PrC if you'd like.

-- N

Click to expand...

OK, it's kind of nice to know I'm not insane. This is the way the class looked after a month of wrangling over it. I decided at the time (which was before Complete Warrior came out) that further stress wasn't worth it. When I saw Nature's Warrior, that didn't help matters a whole lot.

Anyway, I know wildshaping isn't a real interest of his, but melee and casting are. I know it's arcane, but what do you think of Eldritch Knight as another prestige class that might be used as a sort of standard along with Nature's Warrior, Nifft?

This class seems to basically be the Druid with different special abilities. I was thinking of proposing a loss of the animal companion progression and then most of the other special abilities, ending up with a reduced nat armor progression (+1 at level 1, +2 at level 5, +3 at level 9), weapon spcz at level 3, and some other special ability at level 7 (not inherent stat bonuses, whatever it is). Any thoughts on that too?

Nifft said:

Full spellcasting, special abilities out the wazoo, 2 good saves, full animal companion progression, AND inherent bonuses to everything good? No. Friggin'. Way.

Take a look at Complete Warrior, specifically Nature's Warrior and/or War Shaper.

Click to expand...

It looks like it doesnt advance in wildshaping at all. Which means that personally I wouldnt take this prc and instead stick with just straight druid.

Also, I wouldnt take either the natures warrior nor war shaper for more than a level or two, at most, and usually not even that. Again, giving up way too much for too small of a benefit.

EK isn't a good model, because the spellcasting in question will not function with armor. So, the Fighter part is weakened too. You can't grant full BAB along with full Cleric or Druid spellcasting -- it's too strong a combination.

(Some would argue that Druids and Clerics are already the strongest Fighters in the game, with their ability to self-buff, make their own magic armor & weapons, and strong Fort & Will saves.)

So, for any class that's going to make a Druid into a stronger Fighter, I'd require:
- Proficency with all Martial weapons (like Eldrich Knight)
- Ability to cast 2nd level Druid spells

And the benefit would be:
HD: d10
BAB: Full (as Fighter)
NO progress in wildshape, animal companion, or other Druidic powers.
+1 spellcasting every even level
Druid Power: Ever odd level, the Druid's caster level increases for the purpose of spell effects, but the character does not gain additional spells per day. (This will reduce the pain of losing another 5 levels worth of spells.)

This may be too weak for your player. If so, tell him about the joy of Wild Shape (Dire Bear) + Greater Magic Fang + Bull's Strength. Druids are awesome as-is.

-- N

Nifft, personally I wouldnt touch that prc with a 10' pole. Just staying straight druid is 'much' better. In almost every way possible.

So for the player, looks like he may want to just stick with straight druid.

Scion said:

Nifft, personally I wouldnt touch that prc with a 10' pole. Just staying straight druid is 'much' better. In almost every way possible.

So for the player, looks like he may want to just stick with straight druid.

Click to expand...

In every way except BAB and HD, yes. That's rather the point.

It's my aproximation of Eldrich Knight for Druids.

(I've got a player who's playing an EK in my campaign, and a regular Wizard. The difference in power at level 11 is significant. Apparently, WotC has calculated that full BAB is worth quite a lot.)

-- N

So up to 3 Bab and up to 10 hp is worth all of those other perks? Nah

2.5 spell levels, all wildshaping, animal companion, and druid perks.

Just the animal companion alone is worth more than the pidly hp boost, and probably the BAB boost as well. The 2.5 spell levels is also as much or more. The wildshaping can easily make up for both too.

So, in the end, really specializing on one portion of the character is fine. That can be worth a detriment. But a couple of hp and a couple of BAB just doesnt do anything useful in the specializing areana.

Even the shifter, which was a great class, just didnt really compare. It was, overall, much weaker than just going straight druid.

The druid is a hard class to make a prc for, it has a lot of perks all over the place. As such a prc has to be very good at what it is trying to specialize in, perhaps too good for what people are ready to give it.

Again, it really sounds like the druid is just plain better off staying a druid. Maybe a prc that actually is just like the druid, but has some entry requirements, and grants some minor boon for some roleplaying costs (preferably a roleplaying boon for some roleplaying costs). That seems like the best solution at this point.

Just a side note... have the other Variant options from Unearthed Arcana been investigated to replace some of the 'unwanted' aspects of the druid such as the wildshape? Just a thought...