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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
3.5 Druids - what to do about them?
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<blockquote data-quote="MoogleEmpMog" data-source="post: 2423049" data-attributes="member: 22882"><p>Yeah, I like bards, too. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /> </p><p></p><p>It takes a lot of player skill to play a bard effectively, a lot of reworking one's notions, and a bit of favorable circumstance. For instance, bards seem to suffer almost as much as rogues when undead and constructs abound, and have trouble being all they can be in small parties.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I've seen it used. I'm not sure where you draw the line between used and abused. If 'being consistently more effective than a core fighter' is abusing it, then I've seen it abused. IMC, which are manifestly NOT core only or even mostly WotC, it's fairly balanced, but on its own it's balanced against characters with highly optimized builds of multiple synergistic PrCs.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I love to watch all that, too - sometimes. In those circumstances, the druids seem to end up 'merely' average, able to hold their own but outclassed in any one area.</p><p></p><p>However, my players do tend to take tactical initiative most of the time, and whenever they do that, the druids usually excell. Since it's often druidic powers that put them in a position to take the initiative, the druid does double duty.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, this largely depends on what you mean by "broken." I don't have a problem with the core druid because I run very high powered games with very few restrictions; most of my best roleplayers are powergamers and I like to encourage both tendencies. When Druid 20 ends up as effective or moreso than Swashbuckler/Wizard/Bladesinger/Int Monk combos and characters who can key every action off of Charisma multiple times, I do question whether or not it's balanced with the other core classes.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="MoogleEmpMog, post: 2423049, member: 22882"] Yeah, I like bards, too. :) It takes a lot of player skill to play a bard effectively, a lot of reworking one's notions, and a bit of favorable circumstance. For instance, bards seem to suffer almost as much as rogues when undead and constructs abound, and have trouble being all they can be in small parties. I've seen it used. I'm not sure where you draw the line between used and abused. If 'being consistently more effective than a core fighter' is abusing it, then I've seen it abused. IMC, which are manifestly NOT core only or even mostly WotC, it's fairly balanced, but on its own it's balanced against characters with highly optimized builds of multiple synergistic PrCs. I love to watch all that, too - sometimes. In those circumstances, the druids seem to end up 'merely' average, able to hold their own but outclassed in any one area. However, my players do tend to take tactical initiative most of the time, and whenever they do that, the druids usually excell. Since it's often druidic powers that put them in a position to take the initiative, the druid does double duty. Again, this largely depends on what you mean by "broken." I don't have a problem with the core druid because I run very high powered games with very few restrictions; most of my best roleplayers are powergamers and I like to encourage both tendencies. When Druid 20 ends up as effective or moreso than Swashbuckler/Wizard/Bladesinger/Int Monk combos and characters who can key every action off of Charisma multiple times, I do question whether or not it's balanced with the other core classes. [/QUOTE]
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