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Character Builds & Optimization
3.5 Melee Rogue Build (now with extra feats!)
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<blockquote data-quote="StreamOfTheSky" data-source="post: 5130243" data-attributes="member: 35909"><p>Invisible Blade really isn't thatgreat a class. If you're going out of Rogue, consider a 2 level Swordsage dip at levels 9-10 or 8-9. For prestige classes, I like Master Thrower (C.Warrior) or Whisperknife (Races of the Wild, Halfling only), but both are throwing oriented.</p><p></p><p>Titan Fighting: AFAIK, you actually need a source of dodge bonus to replace with the racial +4. Normally this would be the Dodge feat itself (and if you can use the PF versio nthat benefits against all, go for it), but that's only one enemy, kind of stinky for two feats. I like to get Desert Wind Dodge (Tome of Battle), which counts as dodge and gives it against all enemies. You just need to move 10 ft before it activates (you also need to know a Desert Wind maneuver, which you can get from swordsage levels).</p><p></p><p>Every melee rogue should have Staggering Strike from C.Adventurer. Unlike most "ambush" feats, it doesn't reduce your SA damage at all, the fort save DC is very high (damage dealt), and by staggering the enemy and denying him a full attack to retaliate on you...you can actually survive in melee.</p><p></p><p>Savvy Rogue (C.Scoundrel) at levels 11+ is nice, to give extra benefits to whatever Rogue special abilities you have as well as the ones you pick up later.</p><p></p><p>Deadly Defense (S.Scoundrel) is +1d6 damage if you fight defensively, and can apply on both weapons for TWF.</p><p></p><p>The Craven feat (Champions of Ruin?) is just plain crazy. Adds your level (not rogue level, character level) to your sneak attack damage. Crazy!</p><p></p><p>For race, I like Whisper Gnomes a lot, and it's the best of the ones you listed. Anything with LA is generally bad (the Dark template for +1 LA is sometimes worth it). Anything with racial HD is to be avoided like the plague. Bad like with LA in delaying class level progressions, but even worse...if you're using the 3E skill system, you just screwed yourself out of the x4 skills at level one, which as a skill monkey char, kinda really sucks. If it's using PF skills system, less of an issue.</p><p></p><p>Other races: Changeling can be fun, especially for doing a social skills rogue and using the Races of Eberron level 1 racial sub. level (note that Changeling racial sub. levels get 10 + int skill points, so you get an added bonus of getting 4x that number with the level 1 selection).</p><p>I think it was in dragon mag somewhere, I saw it on crystalkeep...anyway, dwarf rogues have a bunch of racial sub levels that give bonus damage against constructs and lose absolutely nothing. Makes one of the tougher foes for a Rogue easier to handle.</p><p>There's a Halfling variant called Strongheart halflings that get a bonus feat like humans do. I think that's in the FR setting books, not too familiar. But the character optimization thread seems to love them.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="StreamOfTheSky, post: 5130243, member: 35909"] Invisible Blade really isn't thatgreat a class. If you're going out of Rogue, consider a 2 level Swordsage dip at levels 9-10 or 8-9. For prestige classes, I like Master Thrower (C.Warrior) or Whisperknife (Races of the Wild, Halfling only), but both are throwing oriented. Titan Fighting: AFAIK, you actually need a source of dodge bonus to replace with the racial +4. Normally this would be the Dodge feat itself (and if you can use the PF versio nthat benefits against all, go for it), but that's only one enemy, kind of stinky for two feats. I like to get Desert Wind Dodge (Tome of Battle), which counts as dodge and gives it against all enemies. You just need to move 10 ft before it activates (you also need to know a Desert Wind maneuver, which you can get from swordsage levels). Every melee rogue should have Staggering Strike from C.Adventurer. Unlike most "ambush" feats, it doesn't reduce your SA damage at all, the fort save DC is very high (damage dealt), and by staggering the enemy and denying him a full attack to retaliate on you...you can actually survive in melee. Savvy Rogue (C.Scoundrel) at levels 11+ is nice, to give extra benefits to whatever Rogue special abilities you have as well as the ones you pick up later. Deadly Defense (S.Scoundrel) is +1d6 damage if you fight defensively, and can apply on both weapons for TWF. The Craven feat (Champions of Ruin?) is just plain crazy. Adds your level (not rogue level, character level) to your sneak attack damage. Crazy! For race, I like Whisper Gnomes a lot, and it's the best of the ones you listed. Anything with LA is generally bad (the Dark template for +1 LA is sometimes worth it). Anything with racial HD is to be avoided like the plague. Bad like with LA in delaying class level progressions, but even worse...if you're using the 3E skill system, you just screwed yourself out of the x4 skills at level one, which as a skill monkey char, kinda really sucks. If it's using PF skills system, less of an issue. Other races: Changeling can be fun, especially for doing a social skills rogue and using the Races of Eberron level 1 racial sub. level (note that Changeling racial sub. levels get 10 + int skill points, so you get an added bonus of getting 4x that number with the level 1 selection). I think it was in dragon mag somewhere, I saw it on crystalkeep...anyway, dwarf rogues have a bunch of racial sub levels that give bonus damage against constructs and lose absolutely nothing. Makes one of the tougher foes for a Rogue easier to handle. There's a Halfling variant called Strongheart halflings that get a bonus feat like humans do. I think that's in the FR setting books, not too familiar. But the character optimization thread seems to love them. [/QUOTE]
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