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5e: Stat the Lady of Pain...so we can overthrow her
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<blockquote data-quote="Ruin Explorer" data-source="post: 8774629" data-attributes="member: 18"><p>I think that comparison shows you're profoundly missing the point of the LoP.</p><p></p><p>The LoP exists for one reason - by messing with portals, sooner or later, the PCs will figure out a way to wreck or destroy Sigil.</p><p></p><p>The LoP exist to stop that. She doesn't interfere in day to day stuff, so the "petty tyrant" thing is literally nonsensical, as a claim. She's not messing with the PCs. She's strictly there to stop the PCs destroying the setting, because it's inevitable that they will figure out a way to do so, especially when the other gods are banned from Sigil (which is essentially done for simplicity and sanity's sake). This defiant attitude to her is senseless. It's like being enraged by a parking attendant. The pettiness isn't on the LoP's side, nor the parking attendant's. It's the on the side of the person enraged.</p><p></p><p>I don't remember "Stone" from the Deadlands (I do remember some other ghastly GMPC though, who actually got retcon'd out of the setting, I believe), but I do Sam Haight, which is who you're referring to in World of Darkness:</p><p></p><p>[URL unfurl="true"]https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Samuel_Haight[/URL]</p><p></p><p>He's almost the polar opposite of the LoP. The LoP exists to NOT be used. The entire point of her existence is to NOT intervene. She's not floating around handing out petty edicts on a daily basis. She's there to have a divinity to stop the setting being blown up or collapsing into anarchy. If you want either, it's easy, just say she vanished, because the natural consequence is Sigil will collapse into warfare, and someone will do something like open a bunch of portals to really bad places and usher people/stuff through, fuelling the warfare further.</p><p></p><p>You could probably replace her with some sort of semi-omniscient council or the like, with strike teams to achieve the same goals, but you're really just adding extra steps.</p><p></p><p>Sam Haight isn't that. Sam Haight is essentially a GMPC specifically for messing with the player. Not to stop them destroying the setting, but to cause problems and be unstoppable in causing those problems. That's again literally the opposite. One exist to solve problems, the other to cause them. Also, the LoP takes nothing from the players. She's just a weird divinity hanging out in Sigil. Whereas Sam Haight is basically everything the PCs are, but better.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ruin Explorer, post: 8774629, member: 18"] I think that comparison shows you're profoundly missing the point of the LoP. The LoP exists for one reason - by messing with portals, sooner or later, the PCs will figure out a way to wreck or destroy Sigil. The LoP exist to stop that. She doesn't interfere in day to day stuff, so the "petty tyrant" thing is literally nonsensical, as a claim. She's not messing with the PCs. She's strictly there to stop the PCs destroying the setting, because it's inevitable that they will figure out a way to do so, especially when the other gods are banned from Sigil (which is essentially done for simplicity and sanity's sake). This defiant attitude to her is senseless. It's like being enraged by a parking attendant. The pettiness isn't on the LoP's side, nor the parking attendant's. It's the on the side of the person enraged. I don't remember "Stone" from the Deadlands (I do remember some other ghastly GMPC though, who actually got retcon'd out of the setting, I believe), but I do Sam Haight, which is who you're referring to in World of Darkness: [URL unfurl="true"]https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Samuel_Haight[/URL] He's almost the polar opposite of the LoP. The LoP exists to NOT be used. The entire point of her existence is to NOT intervene. She's not floating around handing out petty edicts on a daily basis. She's there to have a divinity to stop the setting being blown up or collapsing into anarchy. If you want either, it's easy, just say she vanished, because the natural consequence is Sigil will collapse into warfare, and someone will do something like open a bunch of portals to really bad places and usher people/stuff through, fuelling the warfare further. You could probably replace her with some sort of semi-omniscient council or the like, with strike teams to achieve the same goals, but you're really just adding extra steps. Sam Haight isn't that. Sam Haight is essentially a GMPC specifically for messing with the player. Not to stop them destroying the setting, but to cause problems and be unstoppable in causing those problems. That's again literally the opposite. One exist to solve problems, the other to cause them. Also, the LoP takes nothing from the players. She's just a weird divinity hanging out in Sigil. Whereas Sam Haight is basically everything the PCs are, but better. [/QUOTE]
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