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6-8 encounters/day - how common is this?
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<blockquote data-quote="Flamestrike" data-source="post: 6839049" data-attributes="member: 6788736"><p>Over 3-4 encounters with 1 short rest:</p><p></p><p><strong>Paladin 6 v Fighter (BM) 6:</strong></p><p>Paladin heals 30 hp with lay on hands. Fighter heals 23 with second wind x 2 (adv paladin)</p><p>Paladin has a pool of 14d8 smite damage. Fighter has pool of 8d8 from sup dice (adv paladin)</p><p>Fighter has action surge x 2. Paladin has channel divinity x 2 (even)</p><p>Paladin has divine aura (+ cha to saves). Fighter has bonus feat (even)</p><p></p><p>With 6-8 encounters and 2 short rests:</p><p></p><p><strong>Paladin 6 v Fighter (BM) 6:</strong></p><p>Paladin heals 30 hp with lay on hands. Fighter heals 34 with second wind x 3 (even)</p><p>Paladin has a pool of 14d8 smite damage. Fighter has 12d8 from sup dice (even)</p><p>Fighter has action surge x 3. Paladin has channel divinity x 3 (even)</p><p>Paladin has divine aura (+ cha to saves). Fighter has bonus feat (even)</p><p></p><p>Over 3-4 encounters with 1 short rest:</p><p></p><p><strong>Wizard 6 v Warlock 6:</strong></p><p>Wizard has 4/3/4 spells. Enough to drop 1 spell each of 3rd, 2nd and 1st level per encounter (<strong>22 </strong>spell levels). Warlock has 4 x 3rds - enough to drop 1 x 3rd every encounter (<strong>12 </strong>spell levels) (plus at will invocations and a slightly better cantrip) (adv Wizard)</p><p></p><p>With 6-8 encounters and 2 short rests:</p><p></p><p><strong>Wizard 6 v Warlock (BM) 6:</strong></p><p>Wizard has 4/3/4 spells. Enough to drop around 2 spells per encounter (of levels 1-3) or <strong>22 </strong>spell levels. Warlock has 6 x 3rds - enough to drop just under 1 x 3rd level spell every encounter (plus at will invocations and a slightly better cantrip) or <strong>18 </strong>spell levels plus at will invocations (even)</p><p></p><p>There is no escaping the fact the classes balance at the 6-8/ 2 short rest spot. Reducing the number of encounters or short rests messes with this balance.</p><p></p><p>It's fine to do mind you - the occasional shorter AD is inevitable. Just make sure you push a longer one on them (with more short rests) next time to compensate (and give the Warlock a chance to shine)</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No-one is saying it's a 'hard' limit mate. Its a guideline that you build encounters around (and you can frequently ignore it or intentionally tinker with it if you want). You dont cram 6-8 encounter adventuring days down your parties throats day in day out. You mix it up, limiting some adventures, leaving it in the parties hands for others, pushing shorter ADs on the party from time to time, and pushing longer ones on them from time to time.</p><p></p><p>And as for spells that allow the party safe rest (rope trick etc), they are all well and good. These spells guarantee a safe rest free from <em>wandering monsters.</em> Which is only one of many possible complications - all of which are in the DMs hands. These spells do absolutelty <strong>zero </strong>to help the party:</p><p></p><p></p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Save the princess by (x),</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">prevent the ritual from summoning the demon before (x),</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">find the escape to the dungeon by time (x),</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">stop the BBEG from escaping by (x).</li> </ul><p></p><p>All of which should feature in your adventure design around 50 percent of the time. Give the PCs a time limit for success (just like in the real world, you never have the luxury of having all the time in the world to do what you want).</p><p></p><p>If you as the DM spnt 5 minutes when designing your encoutners to consider the rest pacing/ 5 minute AD meta, and to insert a win/lose condition into your parties adventuring day via a time limit, then all the rope tricks in the world wont help the party.</p><p></p><p>The 'struggles' many DMs have with policing the 5 minute adventuring day almost always comes down to lazy DMing plain and simple (If we're being honest with ourselves) or to being oblivious of the problems of the 5 minute AD, or obliious to the fact that ramping up encounter difficulty is simpy contributing to the problem. </p><p></p><p>Many DMs stat up an encounter and leave it there, or simply cant be bothered with policing the 5 minute AD.</p><p></p><p>When you sit down during the week and design your adventure, spend 5 minutes structuring the encoutners together into an adventuring day. Turn your mind to the rest mechanics, enforce time limits on the party and place win/loss conditions for the party failing to meet that limit. Frame your encoutners within a desired rest paradigm, and let the players pace themselves within that framing.</p><p></p><p>Its really not that hard to do, and the rewards are totally worth it. The party will be cautious, and conserve resources. Deciding to blow that high level slot, or drop a smite or action surge become a meaningful choice (and these abilities stand out more when used sparingly and are not an automatic go to). The party will come together to decide when to rest, and when to push on. It creates a sense of urgency to your adventures and balances the classes.</p><p></p><p>There is really no reason not to ignore policing the 5 minute AD barring lazy DMing. Even if your mind cant accept 6-8 encounters between long rests (bearing in mind a long rest is an 8 hour break) the DMG presents you with other options right in the book (the longer rest variant) to suit slower games.</p><p></p><p>Run an adventure or two that conforms to the 6-8/2 short rest meta and see what Im talking about. Remember to scale your encounters back accordingly to medium-hard levels though (or you will get a TPK on your hands!).</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Flamestrike, post: 6839049, member: 6788736"] Over 3-4 encounters with 1 short rest: [B]Paladin 6 v Fighter (BM) 6:[/B] Paladin heals 30 hp with lay on hands. Fighter heals 23 with second wind x 2 (adv paladin) Paladin has a pool of 14d8 smite damage. Fighter has pool of 8d8 from sup dice (adv paladin) Fighter has action surge x 2. Paladin has channel divinity x 2 (even) Paladin has divine aura (+ cha to saves). Fighter has bonus feat (even) With 6-8 encounters and 2 short rests: [B]Paladin 6 v Fighter (BM) 6:[/B] Paladin heals 30 hp with lay on hands. Fighter heals 34 with second wind x 3 (even) Paladin has a pool of 14d8 smite damage. Fighter has 12d8 from sup dice (even) Fighter has action surge x 3. Paladin has channel divinity x 3 (even) Paladin has divine aura (+ cha to saves). Fighter has bonus feat (even) Over 3-4 encounters with 1 short rest: [B]Wizard 6 v Warlock 6:[/B] Wizard has 4/3/4 spells. Enough to drop 1 spell each of 3rd, 2nd and 1st level per encounter ([B]22 [/B]spell levels). Warlock has 4 x 3rds - enough to drop 1 x 3rd every encounter ([B]12 [/B]spell levels) (plus at will invocations and a slightly better cantrip) (adv Wizard) With 6-8 encounters and 2 short rests: [B]Wizard 6 v Warlock (BM) 6:[/B] Wizard has 4/3/4 spells. Enough to drop around 2 spells per encounter (of levels 1-3) or [B]22 [/B]spell levels. Warlock has 6 x 3rds - enough to drop just under 1 x 3rd level spell every encounter (plus at will invocations and a slightly better cantrip) or [B]18 [/B]spell levels plus at will invocations (even) There is no escaping the fact the classes balance at the 6-8/ 2 short rest spot. Reducing the number of encounters or short rests messes with this balance. It's fine to do mind you - the occasional shorter AD is inevitable. Just make sure you push a longer one on them (with more short rests) next time to compensate (and give the Warlock a chance to shine) No-one is saying it's a 'hard' limit mate. Its a guideline that you build encounters around (and you can frequently ignore it or intentionally tinker with it if you want). You dont cram 6-8 encounter adventuring days down your parties throats day in day out. You mix it up, limiting some adventures, leaving it in the parties hands for others, pushing shorter ADs on the party from time to time, and pushing longer ones on them from time to time. And as for spells that allow the party safe rest (rope trick etc), they are all well and good. These spells guarantee a safe rest free from [I]wandering monsters.[/I] Which is only one of many possible complications - all of which are in the DMs hands. These spells do absolutelty [B]zero [/B]to help the party: [LIST] [*]Save the princess by (x), [*]prevent the ritual from summoning the demon before (x), [*]find the escape to the dungeon by time (x), [*]stop the BBEG from escaping by (x). [/LIST] All of which should feature in your adventure design around 50 percent of the time. Give the PCs a time limit for success (just like in the real world, you never have the luxury of having all the time in the world to do what you want). If you as the DM spnt 5 minutes when designing your encoutners to consider the rest pacing/ 5 minute AD meta, and to insert a win/lose condition into your parties adventuring day via a time limit, then all the rope tricks in the world wont help the party. The 'struggles' many DMs have with policing the 5 minute adventuring day almost always comes down to lazy DMing plain and simple (If we're being honest with ourselves) or to being oblivious of the problems of the 5 minute AD, or obliious to the fact that ramping up encounter difficulty is simpy contributing to the problem. Many DMs stat up an encounter and leave it there, or simply cant be bothered with policing the 5 minute AD. When you sit down during the week and design your adventure, spend 5 minutes structuring the encoutners together into an adventuring day. Turn your mind to the rest mechanics, enforce time limits on the party and place win/loss conditions for the party failing to meet that limit. Frame your encoutners within a desired rest paradigm, and let the players pace themselves within that framing. Its really not that hard to do, and the rewards are totally worth it. The party will be cautious, and conserve resources. Deciding to blow that high level slot, or drop a smite or action surge become a meaningful choice (and these abilities stand out more when used sparingly and are not an automatic go to). The party will come together to decide when to rest, and when to push on. It creates a sense of urgency to your adventures and balances the classes. There is really no reason not to ignore policing the 5 minute AD barring lazy DMing. Even if your mind cant accept 6-8 encounters between long rests (bearing in mind a long rest is an 8 hour break) the DMG presents you with other options right in the book (the longer rest variant) to suit slower games. Run an adventure or two that conforms to the 6-8/2 short rest meta and see what Im talking about. Remember to scale your encounters back accordingly to medium-hard levels though (or you will get a TPK on your hands!). [/QUOTE]
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