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A New Taxonomy for TSR-Era D&D
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<blockquote data-quote="Snarf Zagyg" data-source="post: 8347793" data-attributes="member: 7023840"><p>I don't <em>necessarily </em>disagree with any of this, but I would expand it and draw slightly different conclusions.</p><p></p><p>The Arneson/Gygax OD&D is the LBBs (the Little Brown Books, the White Box, etc.). But that's not necessarily OD&D. That's the stripped down, '74, OD&D, with just <em>Men & Magic</em>, <em>Monsters & Treasure</em>, and <em>Underground & Wilderness Adventures.</em></p><p></p><p>But OD&D was much more than that. From 1975 on, you had the publication of five supplements (<em>Greyhawk</em>, <em>Blackmoor, Eldritch Wizardry, G, DG, & Heroes, Swords & Spells</em>) that were major expansions (except <em>Swords & Spells</em>, that just kind of sucked and should not be spoken of). These supplements rounded out and expanded OD&D extensively from 1975 to 1976. In addition, you had <em>The Strategic Review (</em>later <em>Dragon</em>) providing additional rules additions and clarifications. So by 1977, OD&D was fairly ... advanced. Ahem.</p><p></p><p>Which is what makes me quibble with your statement that OD&D is <em>separate</em> from AD&D. Despite the legal arguments of Gygax, saying that AD&D is separate from OD&D makes the same amount of sense as saying that the AD&D halflings have nothing to do with Tolkien's hobbits. AD&D is OD&D- in 1979, as envisioned by Gygax. That's it. It incorporates the supplements and magazine articles and has expansions and some rules changes, but it's OD&D. As I listed, everything (from the classes to the psionics to everything else) was from the evolution of OD&D via supplements and articles.</p><p></p><p>More simply:</p><p>The LBBs begat the Supplements begat the AD&D PHB.</p><p></p><p>Which brings us to Holmes. Holmes was specifically tasked with creating an introduction to OD&D. It is OD&D. In that sense, it is of the same line as AD&D, since AD&D is OD&D's evolution. Follow?</p><p></p><p>Which brings us to Moldvay's basic. I completely agree with you that Moldvay was tasked with creating a "basic" system and introductory system by using ... OD&D's LBBs (and also referenced Holmes). They went back to the LBBs because they were going to credit Arneson as a co-creator (which they did). But Moldvay (and later Mentzer and the RC) ended up creating a completely separate fork of the game through different rules.</p><p></p><p>In other words, because AD&D (1e and 2e) is part of an unbroken line that goes back to 2e, it is the evolutionary heir to OD&D; Basic is a separate branch that forked off after Moldvay/Cook that was based on the LBBs, but lacked the seven intervening years.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Snarf Zagyg, post: 8347793, member: 7023840"] I don't [I]necessarily [/I]disagree with any of this, but I would expand it and draw slightly different conclusions. The Arneson/Gygax OD&D is the LBBs (the Little Brown Books, the White Box, etc.). But that's not necessarily OD&D. That's the stripped down, '74, OD&D, with just [I]Men & Magic[/I], [I]Monsters & Treasure[/I], and [I]Underground & Wilderness Adventures.[/I] But OD&D was much more than that. From 1975 on, you had the publication of five supplements ([I]Greyhawk[/I], [I]Blackmoor, Eldritch Wizardry, G, DG, & Heroes, Swords & Spells[/I]) that were major expansions (except [I]Swords & Spells[/I], that just kind of sucked and should not be spoken of). These supplements rounded out and expanded OD&D extensively from 1975 to 1976. In addition, you had [I]The Strategic Review ([/I]later [I]Dragon[/I]) providing additional rules additions and clarifications. So by 1977, OD&D was fairly ... advanced. Ahem. Which is what makes me quibble with your statement that OD&D is [I]separate[/I] from AD&D. Despite the legal arguments of Gygax, saying that AD&D is separate from OD&D makes the same amount of sense as saying that the AD&D halflings have nothing to do with Tolkien's hobbits. AD&D is OD&D- in 1979, as envisioned by Gygax. That's it. It incorporates the supplements and magazine articles and has expansions and some rules changes, but it's OD&D. As I listed, everything (from the classes to the psionics to everything else) was from the evolution of OD&D via supplements and articles. More simply: The LBBs begat the Supplements begat the AD&D PHB. Which brings us to Holmes. Holmes was specifically tasked with creating an introduction to OD&D. It is OD&D. In that sense, it is of the same line as AD&D, since AD&D is OD&D's evolution. Follow? Which brings us to Moldvay's basic. I completely agree with you that Moldvay was tasked with creating a "basic" system and introductory system by using ... OD&D's LBBs (and also referenced Holmes). They went back to the LBBs because they were going to credit Arneson as a co-creator (which they did). But Moldvay (and later Mentzer and the RC) ended up creating a completely separate fork of the game through different rules. In other words, because AD&D (1e and 2e) is part of an unbroken line that goes back to 2e, it is the evolutionary heir to OD&D; Basic is a separate branch that forked off after Moldvay/Cook that was based on the LBBs, but lacked the seven intervening years. [/QUOTE]
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