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<blockquote data-quote="Manbearcat" data-source="post: 5976156" data-attributes="member: 6696971"><p>Yes, they feel far more satisfying period...not just from the angle of to give a rogue a "me too!" ability or to not. Removing the wizards, on call, plot-point circumventing tools generally creates more fun for many DMs and a great many players whose staple of their gameplay is not "how can my wizard beat the game?" High level wizard spells (level 5 and upward), with both their hard-coded mechanics and their open-ended ones, narrow the scope of climactic plot potential both during prep and during gameplay rather than broadening them. </p><p></p><p>Is it more fun to actualize an extended Investigatory Skill Challenge (or even free form if you'd like) where all PCs have to play their part in the unwinding of a mystery or intrigue to find out who "Jack the Ripper" really is?...or is it more fun to agonize (in prep) and then inevitably have the wizard prepare one or more of his plot-point-circumventing, on call, Divination spells to Jack Bauerize your DM terrorist plot?...and who at the table is this actually fun for?</p><p></p><p>The exact can be said for any Exploratory plot-point-circumventing spells.</p><p></p><p>Those players whose staple of their gameplay actually is "how can my wizard beat the game?"...well, presumably this is fun for them. And no, you don't have to be a vindictive child with flailing self-esteem issues to just play a standard high level wizard and obliterate the breadth of scope of gameplay...you can do it without even angling toward "how can my wizard beat the game?"</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Manbearcat, post: 5976156, member: 6696971"] Yes, they feel far more satisfying period...not just from the angle of to give a rogue a "me too!" ability or to not. Removing the wizards, on call, plot-point circumventing tools generally creates more fun for many DMs and a great many players whose staple of their gameplay is not "how can my wizard beat the game?" High level wizard spells (level 5 and upward), with both their hard-coded mechanics and their open-ended ones, narrow the scope of climactic plot potential both during prep and during gameplay rather than broadening them. Is it more fun to actualize an extended Investigatory Skill Challenge (or even free form if you'd like) where all PCs have to play their part in the unwinding of a mystery or intrigue to find out who "Jack the Ripper" really is?...or is it more fun to agonize (in prep) and then inevitably have the wizard prepare one or more of his plot-point-circumventing, on call, Divination spells to Jack Bauerize your DM terrorist plot?...and who at the table is this actually fun for? The exact can be said for any Exploratory plot-point-circumventing spells. Those players whose staple of their gameplay actually is "how can my wizard beat the game?"...well, presumably this is fun for them. And no, you don't have to be a vindictive child with flailing self-esteem issues to just play a standard high level wizard and obliterate the breadth of scope of gameplay...you can do it without even angling toward "how can my wizard beat the game?" [/QUOTE]
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